Officials agree Palm Springs and other desert destinations need connections to the coast. The debate is whether Palm Springs needs Amtrak or Metrolink service.
"There is very limited service in that direction, and given the distance of the Coachella Valley from western Riverside County, it fits more in the intercity category rather than as a commuter service," explained Riverside County Transportation Commission Deputy Director John Standiford.
Others, like Rail Passenger Association of California and Nevada Executive Director Richard Silver, argue Metrolink makes more sense because commuter trains are more efficient for moving people in a region like Southern California, while Amtrak works better for long distances.
"I think it will be easier to get it out there," Silver said of Metrolink service to Palm Springs.
« Last Edit: Dec 4, 2009, 12:01pm by Dan Wentzel »
Re: Palm Springs & Coachella Valley « Reply #1 on Dec 4, 2009, 11:49am »
Here's a SunLine Transit System Map. Theoretically this connects to Metrolink in Riverside, but I cannot figure out from this map which bus line it is.
The only passenger service in the Coachella Valley is a thrice-weekly long distance train operated by Amtrak between Los Angeles and Florida. This train is known as the "Sunset Limited". The Sunset Limited train operates through this area in the very early hours of the morning in both directions and primarily serves the leisure and tourism market.
RCTC and the State of California have been evaluating the feasibility of establishing an intercity passenger rail route between the following cities: Los Angeles, Fullerton, Riverside, Palm Springs, and Indio.
The Union Pacific Railroad (UPRR) continues its firm opposition to any new passenger service on its tracks through this area. Notwithstanding this opposition, the California Department of Transportation (Caltrans) continues to propose such service in fiscal year 2010-2011 with a single round trip, adding a second round trip in 2013-2014. This recommendation is contained in the California State Rail Plan: Draft October 2005.
Caltrans has no unilateral powers to compel the UPRR to permit the operation of this train. Nevertheless, for intercity trains (as opposed to a commuter or Metrolink train), there are certain federal processes in place that can ultimately lead to an order compelling the railroad to operate the service.
The public agencies requesting the intercity service may be required to invest large sums in the physical infrastructure of the railroad. Some estimates place the capital investment requirement at a minimum of $500 million for a new set of tracks.
RCTC is working closely with the Coachella Valley and the Pass Areas on this issue and supports the expansion of rail service to additional areas of Riverside County.
« Last Edit: Dec 4, 2009, 12:01pm by Dan Wentzel »
Re: Palm Springs & Coachella Valley « Reply #2 on Dec 4, 2009, 12:15pm »
According to Amtrak the station is pretty sad and in North Palm Springs:
Platform with Shelter Indian Avenue and Palm Springs Station Road 0.6 mi south of I-10 North Palm Springs, CA 92258
---------------------------------
There is a ThruThis stop for connecting bus service to the Palm Springs Airport.
ThruThis is a stop for Amtrak Thruway connecting bus service Amtrak Train service is available at the Palm Springs train station at the Palm Springs train station (PSN).
Curbside Bus Stop only (no shelter) 3400 East Tahquitz Canyon Way Sunline Bus Stop/Palm Springs Airport Palm Springs, CA 92262
« Last Edit: Dec 4, 2009, 12:55pm by Dan Wentzel »
The Transit Coalition "A Better Inland Empire" is watching and exploring proposals for improved train service into the Coachella Valley.
The Palm Springs Amtrak station is located approximately 7 miles north of Downtown Palm Springs. Currently, the station consists of one platform and an open-air shelter with no services within reasonable walking distance. The station also serves as a bus stop for Greyhound and Amtrak buses, but lacks local transit connections.
Concepts to Explore: Public-private investments in this area can result in new urbanism development and connecting bus rapid transit service into the downtown area to south and Desert Hot Springs to the north can provide the necessary feeder service.
Re: Palm Springs & Coachella Valley « Reply #5 on Dec 4, 2009, 3:27pm »
I must admit I've only been to Palm Springs a few times in my life. Enjoyed the trip each time, but there are other places that are higher up on my vacation priorities list.
Still, it does seem like Palm Springs deserves better than what it has got. It's never been a high priority for me, behind the Surfliner/San Diegan route and the existing Metrolink routes, but it is a vacation destination for a lot of Southern Californians.
For what it's worth, I looked it up, and the current Amtrak station location is apparently not the one that the Southern Pacific used (the one in the photo Nick posted). In fact, the current station is further east and a tad closer to P.S. than the old one. It's a bit surprising that the S.P. never built a spur or something to serve the area better.
It seems to me, for Palm Springs Metrolink to be effective, you would need to show that there was a core body of Palm Springs commuters headed for either Riverside or some other area on a day-to-day weekday basis. With Amtrak, you could aim it for the Palm Springs/Palm Desert golf/art vacation folks, and use Surfliner-ish equipment. I remember in the '80s, Amtrak was aiming the San Diegan squarely at Disneyland/beach/vacation travelers, and it was something of a surprise that commuters would take the morning train into Los Angeles. The same thing could be tried with Palm Springs.
Joined: Jun 2005 Gender: Male Posts: 413 Location: Silverlake
Re: Palm Springs & Coachella Valley « Reply #6 on Dec 4, 2009, 4:57pm »
I know of many many people that commute to Palm Springs each weekend. A lot of retired people in the gay community from San Francisco, San Diego and Los Angeles are very used to taking public transit. But would they use it? I could not say. I would. It is kind of sad that such a busy rail trunk for the nation is neglected for commuters. I considered living there but eventually could not stand the thought of endlessly driving to get anywhere (much like most of the nation anyway).
I am bumping this thread because I am going to Palm Springs next month for the first time and wish I could take Metrolink.
I hear you. My parents live out there and it would be a great line. From what I know, Union Pacific will not grant more access to their tracks beyond Amtrak's Sunset Limited. The Desert Cities are of course very interested in Metrolink service, but it doesn't appear to be in the cards for quite a while at best.
Re: Palm Springs & Coachella Valley « Reply #9 on Aug 10, 2011, 4:00pm »
I think that this would be a great stop on a future high speed rail line between LA and Phoenix. LA-Phoenix is the 27th busiest air route in the world and would easily sustain frequent high speed rail service with a local stop at Palm Springs and/or Indio on the way. I think the travel times and frequencies for LA-Palm Springs on a high speed line would be much more appropriate than Metrolink. However, Metrolink has a marginal chance of actually being implemented in the next decade or two. LA-Phoenix high speed rail could be built as an extension eastward from the Riverside branch of phase 2 California high speed rail.
Re: Palm Springs & Coachella Valley « Reply #10 on Aug 10, 2011, 7:28pm »
As to the question of why SP never built a spur into downtown Palm Springs: I'm not sure when Palms Springs really "blossomed" as a resort area, but my guess is after World War II. By then SP had lost interest in short-haul passenger service (they had already dealt off their Portland OR local service to Greyhound, and would soon be selling of Pacific Electric's passenger operations)
Rather than drive, ride! Ride Metro Rail, Metro bus, bicycle, vanpool, carpool, motorcycle!
Joined: Mar 2007 Gender: Male Posts: 399 Location: Near Metro Rapid 761 "station"
Re: Palm Springs & Coachella Valley « Reply #11 on Aug 10, 2011, 8:42pm »
In the past for the Coachella Music Festival, Amtrak ran special service called the Coachella Express that connected to a shuttle bus (kinda like Metrolink's Del Mar horseracing train). Outside the Sunset Limited, that would have been the only other time passenger train service rolled through the Coachella Valley in recent memory.
Re: Palm Springs & Coachella Valley « Reply #12 on Aug 11, 2011, 4:08pm »
From the Riverside County Transportation Commission website regarding Coachella Valley Rail Service.
--------------------------------
Currently the only passenger service in the Coachella Valley is a thrice-weekly long distance train operated by Amtrak between Los Angeles and Florida. This train is known as the "Sunset Limited". The Sunset Limited train operates through this area in the very early hours of the morning in both directions and primarily serves the leisure and tourism market.
RCTC and the State of California have been evaluating the feasibility of establishing an intercity passenger rail route between the following cities: Los Angeles, Fullerton, Riverside, Palm Springs, and Indio.
The Union Pacific Railroad (UPRR) continues its firm opposition to any new passenger service on its tracks through this area. Notwithstanding this opposition, the California Department of Transportation (Caltrans) continues to propose such service in the California State Rail Plan.
Caltrans has no unilateral powers to compel the UPRR to permit the operation of this train. Nevertheless, for intercity trains (as opposed to a commuter or Metrolink train), there are certain federal processes in place that can ultimately lead to an order compelling the railroad to operate the service.
The public agencies requesting the intercity service may be required to invest large sums in the physical infrastructure of the railroad. Some estimates place the capital investment requirement at a minimum of $500 million for a new set of tracks.
RCTC is working closely with the Coachella Valley and the Pass Areas on this issue and supports the expansion of rail service to additional areas of Riverside County.
---------------------------
Is this something for which writing to Congresswoman Mary Bono Mack might be helpful?
From the Riverside County Transportation Commission website regarding Coachella Valley Rail Service.
--------------------------------
Currently the only passenger service in the Coachella Valley is a thrice-weekly long distance train operated by Amtrak between Los Angeles and Florida. This train is known as the "Sunset Limited". The Sunset Limited train operates through this area in the very early hours of the morning in both directions and primarily serves the leisure and tourism market.
RCTC and the State of California have been evaluating the feasibility of establishing an intercity passenger rail route between the following cities: Los Angeles, Fullerton, Riverside, Palm Springs, and Indio.
The Union Pacific Railroad (UPRR) continues its firm opposition to any new passenger service on its tracks through this area. Notwithstanding this opposition, the California Department of Transportation (Caltrans) continues to propose such service in the California State Rail Plan.
Caltrans has no unilateral powers to compel the UPRR to permit the operation of this train. Nevertheless, for intercity trains (as opposed to a commuter or Metrolink train), there are certain federal processes in place that can ultimately lead to an order compelling the railroad to operate the service.
The public agencies requesting the intercity service may be required to invest large sums in the physical infrastructure of the railroad. Some estimates place the capital investment requirement at a minimum of $500 million for a new set of tracks.
RCTC is working closely with the Coachella Valley and the Pass Areas on this issue and supports the expansion of rail service to additional areas of Riverside County.
---------------------------
Is this something for which writing to Congresswoman Mary Bono Mack might be helpful?
Wouldn't hurt to write her and see what she says. I'm sure her office is somewhat knowledgable about the issue.
BTW, I still have a faxed letter from Zev in the 90s stating that a Westside subway is impossible due to the federal ban on tunneling. Maybe I should get him to sign it at the groundbreaking in 2013?
Is this something for which writing to Congresswoman Mary Bono Mack might be helpful?
Hmmm, I'm not sure about her stance on rail, but she doesn't seem to depart much from the republican voting line. Not sure if she'd actually be helpful, but it's worth asking. My guess is one would either get a response indicating that she thinks it's not worth the money or none at all. Hopefully I'd be proven wrong.
Re: Palm Springs & Coachella Valley « Reply #16 on Aug 12, 2011, 2:34pm »
well, she doesn't seem to be opposed to transportation spending requests. mostly road and highway spending, but there's BRT in there, whatever that means.
well, she doesn't seem to be opposed to transportation spending requests. mostly road and highway spending, but there's BRT in there, whatever that means.
however, in the current anti-everything atmosphere in Washington, she may be less willing to promote passenger rail.... worth a shot, though.
more likely than a "no response" would be a generic "thank you for your concern" auto-reply.
My parents vote in her district, as did I for a time. I haven't been very impressed with her representation. I'm not surprised that she likes cars and airports
Re: Palm Springs & Coachella Valley « Reply #18 on Mar 16, 2012, 8:48am »
A new update from The Source: http://thesource.metro.net/2012/03/15/st....pe-valley-line/ While mostly about the Antelope Valley Line, there is also a note about extending Metrolink service to Indio (presumably with another stop North of Palm Springs).
A new update from The Source: http://thesource.metro.net/2012/03/15/st....pe-valley-line/ While mostly about the Antelope Valley Line, there is also a note about extending Metrolink service to Indio (presumably with another stop North of Palm Springs).
Thank you, Matthew.
It says in the article:
Metro staff are now going to flesh out a plan to move forward on some of the more affordable upgrades, with Measure R and high-speed rail bonds two possible funding sources. Director Antonovich on Wednesday introduced a motion seeking to speed that process and asking for further information about potential Metrolink upgrades, including a Bob Hope Airport station for the Antelope Valley Line, seamless train travel between the Antelope Valley and San Diego and Ventura and Indio. The motion is posted after the jump.
I don't often agree with Antonovich, but he has my full support extending Metrolink to Indio.
A new update from The Source: http://thesource.metro.net/2012/03/15/st....pe-valley-line/ While mostly about the Antelope Valley Line, there is also a note about extending Metrolink service to Indio (presumably with another stop North of Palm Springs).
Thank you, Matthew.
It says in the article:
Metro staff are now going to flesh out a plan to move forward on some of the more affordable upgrades, with Measure R and high-speed rail bonds two possible funding sources. Director Antonovich on Wednesday introduced a motion seeking to speed that process and asking for further information about potential Metrolink upgrades, including a Bob Hope Airport station for the Antelope Valley Line, seamless train travel between the Antelope Valley and San Diego and Ventura and Indio. The motion is posted after the jump.
I don't often agree with Antonovich, but he has my full support extending Metrolink to Indio.
I'm guessing if they had a couple round trips timed for weekend travel to and from the coast that it would be a hit. I don't know how many commuters there are from the desert to the Inland Empire. It seems too long for people to be commuting all the way into LA.
Re: Palm Springs & Coachella Valley « Reply #23 on May 20, 2012, 11:52pm »
[quote author=matthewb board=metrolink thread=832 post=28644 time=1337515864 I don't know how many commuters there are from the desert to the Inland Empire. It seems too long for people to be commuting all the way into LA.[/quote]
I now live in Portland, OR. The husband of a co-worker is currently doing a big project in Huntington Beach, and he is living in Palm Springs on the weekend and commuting out to Orange County every week. So there are at least some people doing this super-long commute.
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