Re: Orange Line Extension Progress « Reply #25 on Feb 18, 2012, 10:49am »
Antonio has a creative idea, but as he points out, the 405 overpass may be too low; the 170 overpass probably does have sufficient clearance.
Lost in the midst of this discussion, however, are the physical limitations of buses on this corridor. If you want a longer natural gas bus, it will have even slower acceleration than the abysmal artics they have right now. If you want electric trolleybuses, then you need a lot of extra infrastructure--and since they are two-phase while light rail has three-phase conduit, not entirely applicable to rail conversion either.
In any event, the thread begins with a crucial mistake: to assume that the Extension will overperform its estimates just because the original Orange Line segment did is to ignore crucial differences between the two routes. The original Orange Line ends at the subway terminus, intersects three of the top four bus corridors, parallels existing bus service at nearly every stop, serves two colleges, and east of Van Nuys passes through some moderately dense areas. The Extension has none of these factors going for it, although it will provide connectivity to the original destinations. Many insiders believe the Extension is likely to significantly underperform ridership expectations, especially because there are (a) no destinations along it, (b) very little residential or commercial density along it, and (c) very meager connecting bus service crossing it.
Rather than drive, ride! Ride Metro Rail, Metro bus, bicycle, vanpool, carpool, motorcycle!
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Re: Orange Line Extension Progress « Reply #27 on Feb 18, 2012, 2:30pm »
The extension is part of the Southern Pacific railroad branch the LACTC (pre-Metro) purchased in the early 1990s with Proposition 108 funds (the current Orange Line operates on the east/west part of the SP branch; the extension will operate the north/south portion). This, in addition to Metro's initiative to provide the SFV with north/south rapid transit, is why the Orange Line is extended. It'll mark the first time a Metro colored line will connect to Metrolink outside Union Station. Also, the extension will have a special entrance just north of Nordoff Street at the Division 8 bus yard to allow non-revenue bus movements, primarily for the Orange Line. IMO, I feel that the project isn't accomplishing much in the SFV in terms of fulfilling the transit needs that the Van Nuys Rapidway, Sepulveda Pass corridor, Bob Hope Airport Red Line extension, or a line from North Hollywood to Pasadena would do. Anyone wanting a quick ride from Chatsworth to Downtown L.A. already has speedy (albiet pricier and less frequent) Metrolink and Amtrak trains.
As a daily Orange Line rider I believe have the answer to the problems of headway bunching, a crappy vehicle for transporting a high quantity of bikes and disabled persons, overcrowding at peak hours and of course that pesky 60 ft.state law. The problem is that no one is thinking in the right direction. We need to go up not out. Double decker buses of course! Think about it. The only overpasses on the entire route including the Chatsworth extension are the 170 and the 405. Id need to look at the EIR to see what the clearance is but it looks like there should be more than enough clearance for a double decker bus like this one they have in SLO. They are only 14 ft tall
This guy seems to get it Give him the credit. I just identified the Orange line as a good corridor for it. Most of the first floor could be hollowed out like the ends of the Red Line cars for bikes snd wheelchairs to provide a great boost for multimodal trips in the Valley, my method and in my opinion the most effective way to get around that part of town considering the meager headways of hourly buses and relatively easy terrain ( though nearly always inclined ) for biking and increasing upgrades in bike infrastructure by the City of LA
Antonio is on the right track. How about an articulated double decker? The clearance hight wise is not an issue, as the Freeway underpasses are standard hight, so a double decker has clearance. The real issue is loading and dwell time. And someone would have to develop such a transit bus.
As for Part 2 of the Orange Line, Metro is about to learn that political ideas don't always work. Without increasing the local connecting service, increasing Metrolink frequency and adding the missing Saticoy stop, there isn't going to be any ridership surprise above expectations.
I just identified the Orange line as a good corridor for it. Most of the first floor could be hollowed out like the ends of the Red Line cars for bikes snd wheelchairs to provide a great boost for multimodal trips in the Valley
But then you'd have wasted that space on the ground for a very small addition in capacity. Also, with no doors on the second floor, or a balcony to handle entry and exit from the second floor to make first floor space useful, the line would slow.
An alternative idea I had was to actually replace the 60' buses with 45' buses and make them run more frequently, and solve the transfer problem while we're at it. The Orange Line would run like the busway in Miami, where there would be several lines and they would fan out to provide local service off the right of way.
As a daily Orange Line rider I believe have the answer to the problems of headway bunching, a crappy vehicle for transporting a high quantity of bikes and disabled persons, overcrowding at peak hours and of course that pesky 60 ft.state law. The problem is that no one is thinking in the right direction. We need to go up not out. Double decker buses of course! Think about it. The only overpasses on the entire route including the Chatsworth extension are the 170 and the 405. Id need to look at the EIR to see what the clearance is but it looks like there should be more than enough clearance for a double decker bus like this one they have in SLO. They are only 14 ft tall
Antonio is on the right track. How about an articulated double decker? The clearance hight wise is not an issue, as the Freeway underpasses are standard hight, so a double decker has clearance. The real issue is loading and dwell time. And someone would have to develop such a transit bus.
The Orange Line busway indeed has ample vertical clearance under the San Diego and Hollywood Freeways. (Remember, each freeway bridge was designed to cross over a railroad line.)
State law does not allow double-deck buses taller than 14' 3". The San Diego Freeway bridge has 23' vertical clearance and the Hollywood Freeway bridge has 24' 5" vertical clearance.
Rather than drive, ride! Ride Metro Rail, Metro bus, bicycle, vanpool, carpool, motorcycle!
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Re: Orange Line Extension Progress « Reply #31 on Mar 4, 2012, 2:33pm »
Here's an update on the Orange Line extension which is confirmed to open by early summer 2012. I live in the east SFV and don't have too many opportunities to check on the progress in the west SFV, but I happened to be riding my motorcycle on Canoga Avenue.
From the looks of things, construction is still ongoing. Asphalt has been paved for both the busway and the bikeway, in addition to the concrete at intersections, but markings have not been painted yet. Station awnings are up at most stations, no benches or seats are in place yet. Fencing has not been put up along the Metro owned ROW yet. Certain sections of the northbound lanes of Canoga Avenue are being widened to add right turn pockets and as of now are blocked off by K-rails (or jersey barriers). Traffic signals have been put up with most signals facing away. Not sure if this is a result of the construction, but the street signals at Canoga/Nordhoff (in front of Metro bus yard division 8) were inoperable forcing street traffic to adhere to 4 way stop rules. Traffic signals are being added just north of there at Canoga/Prairie, which is also where a special entrance is located to allow buses to travel from Metro division 8 onto the ROW. Bridges crossing the Los Angeles River (north of Vanowen), a creek just north of Parthenia, and Lassen Street are completed, with the exception of pavement for Lassen and for the approaches. Eastbound Lassen Street at the Orange Line bridge overcrossing is currently single lane (as opposed to the usual two) and will most likely return to two lanes after construction finishes.
Compared to the Expo Line progress, the Orange Line looks like it has ways to go until completion. Lets hope both are ready in time for Carmageddon part deux!
Here's an update on the Orange Line extension which is confirmed to open by early summer 2012. I live in the east SFV and don't have too many opportunities to check on the progress in the west SFV, but I happened to be riding my motorcycle on Canoga Avenue.
From the looks of things, construction is still ongoing. Asphalt has been paved for both the busway and the bikeway, in addition to the concrete at intersections, but markings have not been painted yet. Station awnings are up at most stations, no benches or seats are in place yet. Fencing has not been put up along the Metro owned ROW yet. Certain sections of the northbound lanes of Canoga Avenue are being widened to add right turn pockets and as of now are blocked off by K-rails (or jersey barriers). Traffic signals have been put up with most signals facing away. Not sure if this is a result of the construction, but the street signals at Canoga/Nordhoff (in front of Metro bus yard division 8) were inoperable forcing street traffic to adhere to 4 way stop rules. Traffic signals are being added just north of there at Canoga/Prairie, which is also where a special entrance is located to allow buses to travel from Metro division 8 onto the ROW. Bridges crossing the Los Angeles River (north of Vanowen), a creek just north of Parthenia, and Lassen Street are completed, with the exception of pavement for Lassen and for the approaches. Eastbound Lassen Street at the Orange Line bridge overcrossing is currently single lane (as opposed to the usual two) and will most likely return to two lanes after construction finishes.
Compared to the Expo Line progress, the Orange Line looks like it has ways to go until completion. Lets hope both are ready in time for Carmageddon part deux!
Thanks for the update, Tony!
In other news, Metro staff has worked out their final recommendation for a service plan for the Metro Orange Line this summer.
All-day weekdays and weekends, except late night, two services will operate: North Hollywood-Warner Center & North Hollywood-Chatsworth During weekday peak hours, a Chatsworth-Warner Center "shuttle service" will also run at 15-minute headways with 40' or 45' buses and will "coordinate with Metrolink trains." During the late night, the only service that will run will be a North Hollywood-Warner Center-Chatsworth service.
Knowing the difficulties associated with planning a three-legged network, I'm satisfied with this service plan but Metro will have to carefully explain it to the travelling public. I also am curious to see how the Chatsworth-Warner Center shuttle concept plays out.
OMG I hope the Canoga Park station junction doesn't have the delays the Blue-Expo Line junction did
I rode my bicycle up the from Canoga Park Station to Chatsworth Station last week, I'll post some of the pictures I took of the line. I have to admit the cross platform transfer at the Amtrak/Metrolink station is very nice!
Re: Orange Line Extension Progress « Reply #35 on Apr 19, 2012, 11:40am »
There are no double deck articulated bus currently in production so Metro will have to commission something from scratch. Not to mention such a beast has never been used as transit bus before anywhere in the world... it would be an expensive and risky gambit. But it would be totally awesome thing for bus nerds
A better solution is to ask for some sort of DOT or Caltrans exemption for 80ft double articulated bus to be used. These high capacity 80ft buses are widely used as transit bus all over the world and it will work very well on the Orange line.
Rather than drive, ride! Ride Metro Rail, Metro bus, bicycle, vanpool, carpool, motorcycle!
Joined: Mar 2007 Gender: Male Posts: 399 Location: Near Metro Rapid 761 "station"
Re: Orange Line Extension Progress « Reply #38 on Jun 18, 2012, 10:15pm »
Metro is now conducting pre-revenue service to Chatsworth on buses with headsigns marked "901 CANOGA PARK" in addition to a placard marked "LAST STOP CANOGA STATION". Pre-revenue testing will only take 2 weeks before the opening on the 30th June 2012. This is a pic I took today of run 901-27 in addition to the take-ones from the timetable rack. Also of note, especially due to my commute which entails a 9AM eastbound ride on the Orange Line is that the 4 minute headways last a half hour longer into the late morning.
Joined: Jul 2009 Gender: Male Posts: 23 Location: WLA
Re: Orange Line Extension Progress « Reply #39 on Jun 24, 2012, 7:03am »
This has been a wonderful month in LA with the opening of Culver City on the Expo line and now Chatsworth is finally going to happen. I wonder what the actual increase in traffic will be from the commuter rail line.
Rather than drive, ride! Ride Metro Rail, Metro bus, bicycle, vanpool, carpool, motorcycle!
Joined: Mar 2007 Gender: Male Posts: 399 Location: Near Metro Rapid 761 "station"
Re: Orange Line Extension Progress « Reply #40 on Jun 30, 2012, 6:45am »
The Metro Orange Line Extension to Chatsworth is open! Reminder today that Metro will offer free rides today and tomorrow until 7pm; free fares only applies to the segment from Canoga to Chatsworth stations. Festivities will take place at Canoga and Chatsworth station; Amtrak also serves Chatsworth station for those looking to reach there alternatively. The Transit Coalition will have a booth at the Canoga Station.
At first I was going to ask if you had a superbike but then I realized you must've started at or around Canoga. How long would it be to bike the whole stretch from NoHo to Chatsworth? I'm asking b/c the next time I come out there I'm itching to do just that.
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Think about it. The only overpasses on the entire route including the Chatsworth extension are the 170 and the 405. Id need to look at the EIR to see what the clearance is but it looks like there should be more than enough clearance for a double decker bus like this one they have in SLO. They are only 14 ft tall ![[avatar]](http://i657.photobucket.com/albums/uu296/agentsmithone/2245349939_5ff1f797e6_t.jpg "[avatar]")
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