I'd still like to know why Metro changed the original plan to extract the TBM at 3rd/Hope. (I'm still reading the EIR.) I thought that grassy hill would be perfect for TBM extraction. I'll bet Metro changed that due to the new museum and the threats from Eli Broad.
This isn't official but just a guess on doing construction logistics, they might have thought that they will have to open up the street one block south at 4th/Flower for the Pocket track and future 4th/5th & Flower Station box that they can remove it there too.
Also the method they were originally constructing this was more expensive and thus by continuing the TBM one more block and opening up with a smaller station box footprint they could save a few dollars because they wouldn't need to open up such a large hole there for Bunker Hill.
Re: Downtown Connector EIS/EIR « Reply #726 on Feb 28, 2012, 6:34pm »
I do hope that the pocket track gets built.
The possibility of a station at 4th-5th/ Flower makes too much sense not to leave that underground space for future reference. I'm no architect or engineer, but it seems like Metro could get together with the various developers of the skyscrapers in the area and work out a compromise — split the costs and create something where an underground subway/ retail partnership gets built that brings a profit to the Financial District and helps out Metro Rail at the same time. Mind you, this assumes that the various corporate suits/ county bureaucrats involved learn to think outside the station box.
If nothing happens along those lines, at least when we ride the Regional Connector, we'll know exactly where the station ought to be as we go past.
The possibility of a station at 4th-5th/ Flower makes too much sense not to leave that underground space for future reference. I'm no architect or engineer, but it seems like Metro could get together with the various developers of the skyscrapers in the area and work out a compromise — split the costs and create something where an underground subway/ retail partnership gets built that brings a profit to the Financial District and helps out Metro Rail at the same time. Mind you, this assumes that the various corporate suits/ county bureaucrats involved learn to think outside the station box.
That idea was first broached and the property owners nixed that possibility.
Re: Downtown Connector EIS/EIR « Reply #728 on Feb 29, 2012, 2:12pm »
Sure, that idea was nixed. But how enticing was Metro's offer?
If Metro was just "we'll let you pay for our station," then I can see how the developers wouldn't be interested in that.
What I think Metro needs to do is negotiate, and give them something more. Let them add retail to the station, add portals, maybe even let private development design the station, rather than just pay for a typical Metro station. Metro ought to set some parameters for station platforms, escalators, fare gates, ticket machines, but this could be much more than just an underground box.
Let them get a return on their investment.
« Last Edit: Feb 29, 2012, 2:15pm by James Fujita »
Re: Downtown Connector EIS/EIR « Reply #729 on Mar 28, 2012, 2:39am »
A person who wishes to remain anonymous (at least I think, but I'll respect that) Tweeted me a few PMs addressing this person's concerns, information and thoughts about the Little Tokyo station of the Regional Connector. (The Associated Press would call this "a source close to the negotiations.") These thoughts arrived a few Tweets at a time, so I hope I have interpreted them correctly:
- Japanese Village Plaza's main concern about the project such as it currently exists is that they wanted to "build lower floors" beneath their existing parking structure. It is possible that the newest version of the Connector might conflict with that. - Apparently, JVP's parking plans had not been previously circulated in Little Tokyo.
My thought: I must admit that parking is something that people do complain about in Little Tokyo. This is especially true during the heavy-traffic summer festival months. However, it seems to me that the RC would reduce this need considerably.
And while I fully appreciate what the current owners of JVP have done to improve the shopping mall (such as these shade umbrellas), this move does seem poorly timed.
- Metro recently decided not to renew its contract with The Roberts Group (TRG), which had done outreach for Metro with the Little Tokyo community. This person states that TPG's budget included money for Little Tokyo mitigation and community input.
My thought: The idea that Little Tokyo may not get the full attention that it deserves is somewhat disturbing if it turns out to be true. I have certainly sent Metro plenty of comments, concerns and suggestions without TRG's help, but it seems like somebody ought to be there to be the go-between between Metro and the community. There is supposed to be a Little Tokyo Leadership Council which would presumably serve this purpose, but Streetsblog points out it hasn't been formed yet. Metro certainly needs to make certain that it supports the community, listens to concerns, offers help and provide assistance to business. Construction is going to hit LT harder than it will hit the Financial District. Little Tokyo is NOT Beverly Hills High School.
It would seem that until the EIR gets final approval from the board, the Regional Connector is in limbo. These issues with the Financial District and with JVP need to be resolved quickly so this community relations limbo can end.
I am just optimistic enough to believe that Metro will not, can not simply let the community be ignored. And I believe that the community will not let itself be ignored. The next steps of station design and engineering will be just as important as the previous stages.
« Last Edit: Mar 28, 2012, 3:13am by James Fujita »
Joined: Mar 2011 Gender: Male Posts: 203 Location: Bell Gardens
Re: Downtown Connector EIS/EIR « Reply #730 on Mar 29, 2012, 8:40pm »
So was the parking structure issue something that was put on the back burner as the community rallied for the underground wye or was it something that just never came up until now?
Re: Downtown Connector EIS/EIR « Reply #731 on Mar 30, 2012, 2:19pm »
I'm getting all of this second-hand, so it's not entirely clear. But whatever their plans were, it sounds like it wasn't announced to the public until after it became obvious that the newest plan for the Regional Connector — the one which most of the community supported — would involve tunneling under Japanese Village Plaza. It could be that they wanted clarification, or that they wanted it a few feet to the left or something. It does seem strange that this wasn't brought up earlier. But to be fair, it wouldn't have been an issue with the earlier Regional Connector designs.
Joined: Mar 2011 Gender: Male Posts: 203 Location: Bell Gardens
Re: Downtown Connector EIS/EIR « Reply #732 on Mar 30, 2012, 8:29pm »
I think this community is waayyy better off with the underground wye than with an immense underground parking facility. However, if parking is that much of an issue, I'm sure something can be worked out with the owners of the lot by where the current Little Tokyo Station is.
Re: Downtown Connector EIS/EIR « Reply #733 on Mar 31, 2012, 11:16am »
Just for the record, Japanese Village Plaza's parking structure isn't where the wye will be. It's on the other side of the station. (JVP is at Central, rather than at Alameda).
The Regional Connector seems to be threading the eye of a needle through Little Tokyo, but I do agree that it would be needed more than JVP's parking expansion.
The problem is, every parking space is potentially a money-maker for JVP. This could be an eminent domain issue. **I'm just speculating
Also, the corner of 1st/ Alameda has been used for overflow parking. It would be used for staging during construction. That's one reason why the EIR includes stuff like parking shuttles and remote parking.
Board has approved the EIR and the route for construction as is with only change to the extend of deep bore tunneling in the financial district. The TBM will now go all the way to 4th street instead of 2nd street. I think this will still allow pocket tracks (which preserves the option for a station) to be installed in cut and cover hole where the TBM will exit.
In certifying the EIS/EIR, the Board also adopted Metro’s Locally Preferred Alternative, a 1.9-mile fully underground light rail line that includes three new stations at 1st/Central, 2nd/Broadway, and 2nd/Hope. The board also approved the following design refinements:
•Relocating the Little Tokyo/Arts District underground station to minimize property required and eliminate the cut-and-cover segment on 2nd Street in Little Tokyo originally required for construction.
•Launching a Tunnel Boring Machine (TBM) from the northeast corner of 1st and Alameda Streets, the property formerly known as the Nikkei development, instead of 2nd Street.
•Tunneling to Flower and 4th Streets in the Financial District, further reducing cut and cover in the area.
Metro did offer to let the Financial District pay for a station in the Financial District. The district wasn't too keen on that idea, even though they probably could have afforded it.
It's too bad this didn't work out; Old Bank would have been a rocking name for a subway station.
Joined: Jun 2005 Gender: Male Posts: 413 Location: Silverlake
Re: Downtown Connector EIS/EIR « Reply #738 on Jun 22, 2012, 10:41am »
The Beverly Hills Courier "claims" that The LA Business Journal reports that Little Tokyo has filed a lawsuit against metro - adding to the endless litigation (if it is true). I should have become a Metro Lawyer:
I would read it but I don't want to subscribe or download anything from them:
The Federal Transit Administration (FTA) has just granted the Los Angeles County Metropolitan Transportation Authrity (Metro) a Record of Decision (ROD) for the $1.37 billion Regional Connector Transit Corridor, officially certifying that the project has now satisfied all federal environmental guidelines.
Just a question: Can a ROD be issued if there is a pending lawsuit? I'd like to know if this a cause for a champagne cheer or a drown your sorrows in beer moment.
Just a question: Can a ROD be issued if there is a pending lawsuit? I'd like to know if this a cause for a champagne cheer or a drown your sorrows in beer moment.
Lawsuits can be filed both before and after a federal agency issues a Record of Decision. A ROD gives a green light from the federal government, no more and no less. Local and state governments, as well as courts at all levels, operate independently. Basically, in this case the ROD means that the project is cleared to receive federal funding.
I saw this illustration linked to the Downtown News story about the federal approval and I have to admit I hadn't seen that picture before.
My thought was it seemed to be a bit bulky for the ground-level of a subway station, unless some sort of vendor, shop, lockers or bicycle parking was included.
It would appear to be either the Little Tokyo station or Second/ Broadway, but the caption doesn't say.
I saw this illustration linked to the Downtown News story about the federal approval and I have to admit I hadn't seen that picture before.
My thought was it seemed to be a bit bulky for the ground-level of a subway station, unless some sort of vendor, shop, lockers or bicycle parking was included.
It would appear to be either the Little Tokyo station or Second/ Broadway, but the caption doesn't say.
It kinda looks like the public restroom at the beach. The shower is on the left side I think.
Whatever and wherever it is, it's a handsome piece of architecture though! For the sake of consistency and to keep people from jumping to conclusions, I wish they had used a rendering that was going to actually be built. Or is that the fabled 4th/5th St. Station?
I'm not really a fan of architecture for the sake of architecture. Art is good, and memorials and what not. But I can't imagine why Metro would need that much space.
I highly doubt that they would put in showers. But I am curious to know what they have in mind. If you look at the scale of it, it is large. It looks like an elevator on the left side, and a subway entrance on the right.
I want my subway entrances to be subway entrances. Stairs, escalator, a few maps and signs and a nice overhang to keep the sun/ rain off. This looks like more than that.
Little Tokyo would be the most likely spot, given that they will eminent domain out the restaurants across from JANM. If that were the case, perhaps they can build the current owners a new building, but this doesn't look like that, either.
Looks like Metro decided to stick with the cut and cover of that whole section, since the 2 alternatives they studied cost more and had schedule impact. Hopefully the businesses in question will just suck it up and not start filing lawsuits...
I really want to get excited and say this is going to bring back 4th/5th St. Station. But I know it's not. So is this just a cost cutting measure to keep the project in budget?
I really want to get excited and say this is going to bring back 4th/5th St. Station. But I know it's not. So is this just a cost cutting measure to keep the project in budget?
If it gets built after all, I'd like to see them call it the "Library" or the "Central Library" station. Picture a literary theme for the station art!
I really want to get excited and say this is going to bring back 4th/5th St. Station. But I know it's not. So is this just a cost cutting measure to keep the project in budget?
It's not a cost cutting measure, it's just sticking with an existing construction plan rather than switching to a more expensive option. This won't free up more money somehow.
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