Joined: Mar 2007 Gender: Male Posts: 4,007 Location: Palms, LA, CA
Re: Exposition Light Rail Line Project Development « Reply #5201 on Apr 28, 2012, 9:32am »
I am glad it worked out!
Although, the 4:54 am train couldn't be the first sweep train because there were at least two (~ 4:35 am) sweep trains parked both at Tracks 3 and 4 by Expo Park / USC last night and they would have been in the way if they didn't sweep before that. But then perhaps no one got a chance to hop on those before you guys did.
We got the limited-edition TAP card at the ceremony yesterday, along with an acrylic mold of a small Expo card and a large Expo poster.
I was surprised to find out that the problems with the line were (or perhaps are) still continuing and CPUC almost had the opening canceled:
This problem must be the same as what happens in this video shortly after passing Crenshaw Blvd at around 6:10 minutes. The train cannot pick up the cab signal; it beeps to warn the operator and comes to a halt. Then the operator needs to move the control lever back and forth to reset it until the cab signal is picked up and the train can move:
Although, the 4:54 am train couldn't be the first sweep train because there were at least two (~ 4:35 am) sweep trains parked both at Tracks 3 and 4 by Expo Park / USC last night and they would have been in the way if they didn't sweep before that. But then perhaps no one got a chance to hop on those before you guys did.
The 0454 train isn't a sweep train, but it is the first train in passenger service. If you look at the operators schedule and compare it to the published timetable you'll see that the sweep trains are not in passenger service. The first sweep train that came into 7th/metro was ours and the second one was pulling in as we pulled out. There were no passengers on either train prior to arriving. Also we passed the first eastbound train at Farmdale which also matches the schedule.
Also interviewed in the video is Mr. Clint Simmons with his large, colorful "We can't sleep" sign, who has been hanging out at Farmdale with it.
lol. Thanks Gokhan. I didn't notice the sign, but it was evidently there for the first run along with two protesters because someone on the train mentioned it.
Joined: Mar 2007 Gender: Male Posts: 4,007 Location: Palms, LA, CA
Re: Exposition Light Rail Line Project Development « Reply #5205 on Apr 28, 2012, 4:49pm »
Expo Line trains were packed today in the afternoon, despite running very short headways! It must be perhaps 200,000 people who rode the line today.
It was a nice day. The line looks really great. Every station looks different. I noticed how good the Crenshaw Station looked today -- reminds me the Gold Line Mission Station, with better landscaping.
Expo Line trains were packed today in the afternoon, despite running very short headways! It must be perhaps 200,000 people who rode the line today.
It was a nice day. The line looks really great. Every station looks different. I noticed how good the Crenshaw Station looked today -- reminds me the Gold Line Mission Station, with better landscaping.
Photos later.
Thanks for the update. Glad that I went early...and earlier.
Expo Line trains were packed today in the afternoon, despite running very short headways! It must be perhaps 200,000 people who rode the line today.
It was a nice day. The line looks really great. Every station looks different. I noticed how good the Crenshaw Station looked today -- reminds me the Gold Line Mission Station, with better landscaping.
Photos later.
200,000 is very generous Gokhan. We had 80,000 for Gold Line Eastside opening and that had hour long waits to bored at stations and people could not even bored at some stations. Today was much much easier. My prediction is 40 - 50,000 riders. But eh, unlike the Eastside which had a single Sunday opening, the Expo has a 2 day full weekend opening celebration.
But still, very happy for today's opening! We should all be proud of our advocacy to Expo, some more than others. Thank you all!!!!
Re: Exposition Light Rail Line Project Development « Reply #5208 on Apr 28, 2012, 6:49pm »
200,000 is probably too high but 50,000 is probably too low.
I was at La Cienega station this afternoon around 3 pm and they had to temporary close the stairs because the platform got too crowded and dangerous. I'd say 100,000 boarding is probably about right since the line is a little longer than East Side.
Every single train leaving La Cienega today, except for the really early morning runs, were packed with no standing room left. I didn't stick around Metro Center for very long but I imagine every train leaving Downtown was also packed like the one I was on.
The USC Expo Park station was also super crowded with lots of people waiting for trains in both directions. I waited on the platform for 45 minutes just taking photos and marvel at a dream come true ( ). And base on my observations, I would guess that about 150 people either board or got off the train every 6 minutes in both directions. If you extrapolate that, it means maybe around 30,000 people used the USC Expo Park station today.
Joined: Mar 2007 Gender: Male Posts: 4,007 Location: Palms, LA, CA
Re: Exposition Light Rail Line Project Development « Reply #5210 on Apr 29, 2012, 1:17am »
Regarding today's boardings, I would say each train carried about 400 passengers. Assuming that most people boarded the train about 4 times on the average, that probably comes to about 400 passengers x (60 minutes/hour / 6 minutes) x 10 hours x 4 boardings/passenger = 160,000 Expo boardings on Saturday. A more conservative estimate using 300 passengers per train and 6 hours of operation would give a ridership of 70,000. I guess 100,000+ seems to be a fair number. Tomorrow we may see a similar number.
The reason Eastside Gold Line was more crowded was probably they didn't have as many trains. What Expo saw today was the ridership of Blue Line on a work day with more riders during off-peak hours and riders boarding an unboarding up to 4 or more times, instead of the usual 2 times. And we know the ridership of the Blue Line.
Regarding today's boardings, I would say each train carried about 400 passengers. Assuming that most people boarded the train about 4 times on the average, that probably comes to about 400 passengers x (60 minutes/hour / 6 minutes) x 10 hours x 4 boardings/passenger = 160,000 Expo boardings on Saturday. A more conservative estimate using 300 passengers per train and 6 hours of operation would give a ridership of 70,000. I guess 100,000+ seems to be a fair number. Tomorrow we may see a similar number.
The reason Eastside Gold Line was more crowded was probably they didn't have as many trains. What Expo saw today was the ridership of Blue Line on a work day with more riders during off-peak hours and riders boarding an unboarding up to 4 or more times, instead of the usual 2 times. And we know the ridership of the Blue Line.
I rode both in the early morning and mid-afternoon and whatever number of people rode, it seemed quite a bit less than the gold line east LA crowd. But then again Expo has more stations so the same amount of people spread among more stations would seem less. But the trains weren't full even when I left around 2 pm.
I watched boarding around the USC station for awhile and sometimes 30 or 40 people would board and other times 5 or 6. At 7th/metro some trains would leave pretty full (never completely full as there were many people standing even with empty seats) and the next might have only 100 people on it. I have a photo that I may post later of an Expo train that we passed at 23rd with only a handful of people on it. At least in the first car.
At the gold line east LA, there were crowds that metro wasn't prepared for. We had to stand across the street because the platforms would be full. And this was at several stations. There was a very long line to board at Union Station that extended down the passenger tunnel. I guess the same happened at La Cienega, but in general the gold line platforms were much busier along the entire route. It was hard to board the gold line intermediate stations without having to skip a train because they were so packed.
My impressions based on the people that number of people that I observed boarding at each station was that the gold line was considerably more busy. If the number for Expo even approaches the gold line number, I'd be surprised.
Re: Exposition Light Rail Line Project Development « Reply #5215 on Apr 29, 2012, 10:23am »
On the Expo Line right now. Ridership is very light. Some stations have maybe 5 people boarding at most. We've hit every red light on Flower street (Flower street is going to give a bad impression of this line). Headways are unrealistic to meet with trains every 6 minutes unfortunately and Blue Line operations. Its taken 31 min from La Cienega to 23rd. And now another 15 from 23rd to 7th street. Operations need improvement or we need Connector really badly!
Weird that La Cienega has no escalators, or did I just miss them?
Thanks for the photos!
I am glad you enjoyed them!
Metro doesn't build escalators on outdoor stations. They are afraid that they will break too often because of weathering. All aerial Expo stations have two elevators and two stairs (and two emergency stairs I think).
With the Expo Line, a lot of people who wanted to ride it couldn't because they couldn't find parking, especially so since they had temporary no-parking zones in the vicinities of stations.
On the Expo Line right now. Ridership is very light. Some stations have maybe 5 people boarding at most. We've hit every red light on Flower street (Flower street is going to give a bad impression of this line). Headways are unrealistic to meet with trains every 6 minutes unfortunately and Blue Line operations. Its taken 31 min from La Cienega to 23rd. And now another 15 from 23rd to 7th street. Operations need improvement or we need Connector really badly!
They need signal priority for trains, period. LADOT, listen to this!
They need signal priority for trains, period. LADOT, listen to this!
Don't you think that signal priority (ie lights changing at irregular intervals when trains approach) would be confusing for both drivers and pedestrians and potentially lead to more accidents?
They need signal priority for trains, period. LADOT, listen to this!
Don't you think that signal priority (ie lights changing at irregular intervals when trains approach) would be confusing for both drivers and pedestrians and potentially lead to more accidents?
Not if it's done properly. There is signal priority at Exposition/Rodeo and it works perfectly.
The only drawback is some additional delay on vehicle traffic, which is why LADOT doesn't want it.
Metro doesn't build escalators on outdoor stations. They are afraid that they will break too often because of weathering. All aerial Expo stations have two elevators and two stairs (and two emergency stairs I think).
That makes sense, but unless I'm mistaken the green and blue line elevated stations all have escalators although the gold line freeway stations don't. Also, maybe it was my imagination, but La Cienega felt taller than the rest. I guess that it felt a little odd to climb that many steps without an escalator, but the reasoning makes sense. Escalator repair tends to be frequent, take a long time, and I'm sure that much money is spent on it.
Edit: Maybe not all of the blue line stations have them. In fact, maybe just Rosa Parks.
« Last Edit: Apr 29, 2012, 12:41pm by bluelineshawn »
Don't you think that signal priority (ie lights changing at irregular intervals when trains approach) would be confusing for both drivers and pedestrians and potentially lead to more accidents?
Not if it's done properly. There is signal priority at Exposition/Rodeo and it works perfectly.
The only drawback is some additional delay on vehicle traffic, which is why LADOT doesn't want it.
I guess that there must be some way to do it, but if they did it like Rodeo/Exposition it could take several minutes for lights to change depending on train traffic. Ok for cars because over time drivers could learn to find alternate routes, but not so great for pedestrians. And we should expect to have more pedestrians as the rail system, downtown/LA Live/convention center, etc expand.
Metro doesn't build escalators on outdoor stations. They are afraid that they will break too often because of weathering. All aerial Expo stations have two elevators and two stairs (and two emergency stairs I think).
Not true, Metro has plenty of elevated stations with escalators. A few examples:
Joined: Mar 2007 Gender: Male Posts: 4,007 Location: Palms, LA, CA
Re: Exposition Light Rail Line Project Development « Reply #5223 on Apr 29, 2012, 12:46pm »
Ah, OK, but I guess for current and future projects, they don't want to build escalators because of maintenance issues.
I also noticed that at La Cienega the hole that goes through the elevated structure is much larger than the staircase. They probably thought of putting escalators next to the staircase but then they gave up. Unfortunately this large hole makes the platform very narrow at that location.
Yes, I also noticed that the La Cienega Station is an awfully high climb, not suited for those who are not fit. They would have to take the elevators, which are very nice. Nowadays the vehicular clearance requirements for the bridges are very high and they make the access for elevated stations more difficult.
Not if it's done properly. There is signal priority at Exposition/Rodeo and it works perfectly.
The only drawback is some additional delay on vehicle traffic, which is why LADOT doesn't want it.
I guess that there must be some way to do it, but if they did it like Rodeo/Exposition it could take several minutes for lights to change depending on train traffic. Ok for cars because over time drivers could learn to find alternate routes, but not so great for pedestrians. And we should expect to have more pedestrians as the rail system, downtown/LA Live/convention center, etc expand.
I think waiting areas at the median would allow pedestrians to wait when a train is coming. Also, signal priority can be made so that when a train is approaching, the ped signal doesn't go green to begin with.
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Liberte Chan looks pretty cute by the way.
). And base on my observations, I would guess that about 150 people either board or got off the train every 6 minutes in both directions. If you extrapolate that, it means maybe around 30,000 people used the USC Expo Park station today.
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