Re: Westside Extension Meetings « Reply #801 on Jun 24, 2011, 2:47pm »
I agree with the editorial, but the golf course issue is a red herring.
The east end of Chinatown station was positively dreadful until they put Homegirl Cafe nearby and even at Union Station, if you walk out the East Portal and head out beyond the bus loop to Vignes, you end up at an off-ramp, a Denny's and some sort of giant police parking lot. Perefctly useful to the LAPD, I'm sure but not much to look at.
It's obviously the SOUTH side of Santa Monica which would be worth the station, although Constellation would be better.
I agree with the editorial, but the golf course issue is a red herring.
The point is you want to position the station so you have or will have dense development all around the station. Half as many destinations fall within a convenient walking distance catchment area for a Santa Monica station as do for a Constellation station.
Side note: I attended the Century City Station Area Advisory Group meeting earlier this week. The Century City stakeholders saw no point in discussing the Santa Monica station location and especially in discussing the Century Park East station location. The members were extremely frustrated that Metro claimed to be seeking their input yet were still presenting the two "worthless" Santa Monica Blvd station options.
« Last Edit: Jun 24, 2011, 3:51pm by Justin Walker »
The point is you want to position the station so you have or will have dense development all around the station. Half as many destinations fall within a convenient walking distance catchment area for a Santa Monica station as do for a Constellation station.
Side note: I attended the Century City Station Area Advisory Group meeting earlier this week. The Century City stakeholders saw no point in discussing the Santa Monica station location and especially in discussing the Century Park East station location. The members were extremely frustrated that Metro claimed to be seeking their input yet were still presenting the two "worthless" Santa Monica Blvd station options.
Why would Metro possibly even consider the Santa Monica Blvd options any further? It's quite obvious that Constellation Blvd is the better choice, and the longer Metro keeps all three options open, the more time they give the BHHS NIMBYs to mobilize, start a coalition, and really start creating problems, like lawsuits.
Why would Metro possibly even consider the Santa Monica Blvd options any further? It's quite obvious that Constellation Blvd is the better choice, and the longer Metro keeps all three options open, the more time they give the BHHS NIMBYs to mobilize, start a coalition, and really start creating problems, like lawsuits.
The point of studying the options is to have a defense in case of a lawsuit. Metro's lawyers will be able to say that they studied the crazy idea and it did not pencil out.
I suggest cashing the check before the banks close today, not investing the money in Greek or Portuguese bonds, perhaps not even US Bonds...
This has me wondering if they can actually start construction in 2013, even if all money sources haven't yet been identified to built it in 10 years like the 10/30 plan hopes to do. You certainly wouldn't want to start the $5.3 billion project with that $640 million plus the Measure R money of $4.07 billion that will trickle in over 30 years, only to find out that you have to stop construction when the initial $640 million runs out? Not sure how that works...
Maybe Metro will put out a press release in a few days indicating what the plan will be.
I suggest cashing the check before the banks close today, not investing the money in Greek or Portuguese bonds, perhaps not even US Bonds...
This has me wondering if they can actually start construction in 2013, even if all money sources haven't yet been identified to built it in 10 years like the 10/30 plan hopes to do. You certainly wouldn't want to start the $5.3 billion project with that $640 million plus the Measure R money of $4.07 billion that will trickle in over 30 years, only to find out that you have to stop construction when the initial $640 million runs out? Not sure how that works...
Maybe Metro will put out a press release in a few days indicating what the plan will be.
RT
They are going to start in 2013 no matter what barring any unforeseen major problem (i.e. lawsuit). The question is whether they can start work on the entire project or just the first phase and that depends on whether New Starts matching funds will be made available (some Republicans in Congress are currently trying to gut the program) and also whether America Fast Forward will be in place or not.
They will have to start negotiating a contract in about 9 months give or take a few months, so if AFF is not in place by then, they probably won't be able to plan the project all at once and would have to build in phases. I imagine this $640M loan will help and may allow them to get that first phase to La Cienega instead of Fairfax if AFF falls apart, but that is just a complete guess on my part
If you thought folks in greater LA were beyond the xenophobic fear that public transit will ruin the tonier areas of the metropolis by providing access for the poor, unwashed masses, you'd be wrong. According to the Los Angeles Business Journal (subscription required), Rodeo Drive-area merchants are organizing to fight the proposed stop near Wilshire and Beverly Drive--last month, 20 merchants gathered at Spago to discuss their anti-station strategy. Aside from worries over construction impacts, Paris Nourafshan, an owner of an office tower at 9454 Wilshire, provided the following rationale for opposition: "The people who shop Rodeo Drive now don't come in by transit bus, so I don't think someone who shops on Rodeo Drive is going to take the subway. The subway riders are not potential shoppers. They cannot afford the kind of products retailers in the Golden Triangle sell." It's limousines--and possibly their own cars--that get the richies to Rodeo Drive, the merchants say.
Another local merchant, Douglas Chrismas, owner and director of Ace Gallery on Wilshire near Canon Drive, has a valid reason for concern over the subway--his business may have to be bought out to make way for the Golden Triangle station. But he had this to say, "The construction will drive away business and we're concerned that once the subway opens, we will lose our high-end clientele permanently as businesses start catering to the subway passengers."
Chrismas said he fears not only that Harry Winston and Gucci will take their business elsewhere (where exactly is not stated--Palms, maybe? The Beverly Center would probably be happy to have them too.), but also the crime that will happen once the stop opens. Nourafshan worries too--he says he often has to clean up detritus from the local bus bench: "That's just from a single bus stop. I shudder to think what would happen with a subway station here – a station, by the way, that would not have any restrooms."
John Mirisch, the Beverly Hills councilman fighting hard against the Century City station at Constellation and Avenue of the Stars, actually disagrees with the merchants and thinks it'll be a good when the stores' hourly workers can take the train to work. "One of the biggest problems we have in the Golden Triangle is parking, with many spaces being taken by employees," Mirisch told the Journal. "If just a small portion of the employees could be enticed to take the subway, we could free up many more spaces for shoppers and that would boost business, not hurt it."
The Journal notes that this class talk was prevalent when a Westside subway extension was floated in the 1980s, and that even back then, people pointed at Beverly Hills naysayers and called them elitists. Beverly Hills might need a new publicist if these stories keep breaking. · Subway to the Sea? Don't Stop at Rodeo Drive [LABJ; subscription only] · $640M Loan for Westside Subway, Work Could Start Next Year [Curbed LA]
Were it not for the additional delays for new studies/meetings and the $$ it would involve to change things mid-stream, I think Metro should call the Beverly Hills NIMBYs' bluff and just shove the whole alignment down to Olympic after Fairfax (stations at La Cienega/Olympic and Beverly/Olympic).
The "Platinum Triangle" could avoid the horrors of the great unwashed AND the Century City station could be approached from the south (with a north/south alignment on Avenue of the Stars) avoiding their precious BH High School. (As an added benefit the tunnel would be perfectly aligned to head north under the golf course to continue to Westwood.)
Then again, BH would then bitch that they are getting "sub-par" station locations (though it might provide a nice boost to Beverly Drive between Wilshire and Pico.)
Actually, I love the suggestion of an Olympic alignment and approaching Constellation from the south. ...What a coup that would be, in particular, for the Orthodox Jewish community south of Olympic and along Pico, and what an opportunity to gain a whole middle class sector of the Westside--from Palms clear to BH--beginning to rethink and reorient themselves regarding their personal transportation.
...And the idea doesn't avoid BH. Olympic Bl. is in BH from La Cienega to Century City!
Actually, I love the suggestion of an Olympic alignment and approaching Constellation from the south. ...What a coup that would be, in particular, for the Orthodox Jewish community south of Olympic and along Pico, and what an opportunity to gain a whole middle class sector of the Westside--from Palms clear to BH--beginning to rethink and reorient themselves regarding their personal transportation.
...And the idea doesn't avoid BH. Olympic Bl. is in BH from La Cienega to Century City!
After the rail line opens...guess what the # 1 complaint will be: "Why did Metro bypass Rodeo boulevard..that is as dumb as the Aviation Station/LAX connection...2 mile gap!"
Wilshire/Rodeo deserves a station. It's like bypassing Champs-Elysses, 5th Avenue, Michigan Avenue, etc... Tourists, companies (look at how many high rises are in the Triangle). It makes too much sense NOT to bypass Rodeo. If you go south on Olympic.........the layperson will blame Metro, as they do today for the Green Line, and not the community at large. And you know Metro does not keep needing the negative press due to missed connections....
Anyone realize that Wilshire/Normandie & Wilshire/Western opened 15 years ago today? In addition to Wilshire/Vermont.
15 years. I started working downtown a couple months later and began taking the 320 Wilshire bus and this then new extension. The Wilshire area around those stations have experienced a renaissance over the last 15 years. I wish somebody like the LA Times would do a chronicle of this area and Hollywood before the subway and now.
Screw BH, for all the trouble they're causing they deserve a urine-filled elevator. Metro should build the good ones (as in the Paris picture) at Westwood, Century City, Fairfax and the other non-Beverly Hills stations.
Screw BH, for all the trouble they're causing they deserve a urine-filled elevator. Metro should build the good ones (as in the Paris picture) at Westwood, Century City, Fairfax and the other non-Beverly Hills stations.
Yeah but you never know. Maybe the BH Merchants will like that kind of a portal.
Screw BH, for all the trouble they're causing they deserve a urine-filled elevator. Metro should build the good ones (as in the Paris picture) at Westwood, Century City, Fairfax and the other non-Beverly Hills stations.
Yeah but you never know. Maybe the BH Merchants will like that kind of a portal.
you know, I'm not really a fan of big, grand entrances. I'd rather have lots of little entrances than one big entrance.
however, pretty much all of the Metro Rail subway entrances have been nice and vaguely artistic, whether it was at Boyle Heights or Hollywood. It would be kind of petty to say no to a decent entrance, if not a fancy one, in Beverly Hills when every other station has been decent.
and, if BH wants a station that is better than average, they can certainly afford to pay for better entrances.
however, pretty much all of the Metro Rail subway entrances have been nice and vaguely artistic, whether it was at Boyle Heights or Hollywood. It would be kind of petty to say no to a decent entrance, if not a fancy one, in Beverly Hills when every other station has been decent.
and, if BH wants a station that is better than average, they can certainly afford to pay for better entrances.
Sometimes you have to meet halfway with people to get things done, and we are seeing the consequences of not doing so in Washington.....
The reason I think the BH merchants MIGHT like that Paris-style portal (and in turn, accept a subway station in general) is that it's quite possible they could have assumed that this was the kind of entrance style they were going to get for subway entrances:
For obvious reasons, the Paris-style subway entrance would seem to better fit Beverly Hills' "global image"... which is the kind of approach Metro has been doing lately when designing subway stations and station entrances.
I don't think it's asking too much (I mean is it really all that more expensive?) for Metro to take that Paris-style route when working on the design for the Rodeo Station entrances.
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