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Post by thanks4goingmetro on Oct 7, 2011 14:36:36 GMT -8
Conversation overheard on a crowded 40ft Metro Rapid 757: The 757 may be on the chopping block again to be cut back to Limited service as a '357.' It was a heated discussion between the frustrated Metro operator and a daily rider/transit advocate regarding how overcrowded and infrequent the service is for the high ridership load, the fact that the bus at the time was a 40 foot made matters worse. A good point was brought up about the 400 hours of service cut last time around (for the whole system, I believe). If true, this is insult to injury for what is one of the 3-5 top bus corridors in Los Angeles. If you are familiar with the east-west commute in Los Angeles by bus on any of the lines, be it 733 or 720 or any Local line, Western Ave is the street that buses load up with passengers or the buses half-way empty out on in ons and offs, and will likely increase so with the Expo Line coming soon. Something ought to be done sooner rather than later, like that ambitious examination of potential busway routes by the Mayor as Chairman of Metro. If this cut is being sought by Metro at very least service should be increased and it be put at the front of the line for a busway, Wilshire Blvd already has its on the way.
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Post by LAofAnaheim on Oct 7, 2011 14:41:46 GMT -8
Conversation overheard on a crowded 40ft Metro Rapid 757: The 757 may be on the chopping block again to be cut back to Limited service as a '357.' It was a heated discussion between the frustrated Metro operator and a daily rider/transit advocate regarding how overcrowded and infrequent the service is for the high ridership load, the fact that the bus at the time was a 40 foot made matters worse. A good point was brought up about the 400 hours of service cut last time around (for the whole system, I believe). If true, this is insult to injury for what is one of the 3-5 top bus corridors in Los Angeles. If you are familiar with the east-west commute in Los Angeles by bus on any of the lines, be it 733 or 720 or any Local line, Western Ave is the street that buses load up with passengers or the buses half-way empty out on in ons and offs, and will likely increase so with the Expo Line coming soon. Something ought to be done sooner rather than later, like that ambitious examination of potential busway routes by the Mayor as Chairman of Metro. If this cut is being sought by Metro at very least service should be increased and it be put at the front of the line for a busway, Wilshire Blvd already has its on the way. It's not true. That's just heresay. Metro already voted for no more service cuts in FY2012. People sometimes speak out of frustration, but unless there was a discussion at the Metro Board, the driver is just venting.
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Post by thanks4goingmetro on Oct 7, 2011 15:01:27 GMT -8
It's a relief, if it is not true, but there is still a serious problem going unresolved here. The commuting public on this particular line would appear to benefit greatly from increased Rapid service option similar to Wilshire.
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Post by LAofAnaheim on Oct 7, 2011 15:12:58 GMT -8
It's a relief, if it is not true, but there is still a serious problem going unresolved here. The commuting public on this particular line would appear to benefit greatly from increased Rapid service option similar to Wilshire. Wilshire is a unique street and there is no street in LA (or the rest of the USA) that deserves the amount of bus service that Wilshire boulevard gets. Rapid scheduled every 2 -5 minutes...is pretty much unheard of. I would LOVE more bus service, but we have to be practical. Wilshire is a unqiue street and is standing room only all the way until 2 am on Metro Rapids. No bus corridor in LA can replicate that type of ridership. None. Western deserves transit service like Venice, Vermont and Santa Monica boulevard. Isn't Western the 3rd busiest corridor in LA? I would agree that Rapids need to be on Western 7 days a week...and not 5.
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Post by thanks4goingmetro on Oct 7, 2011 15:35:04 GMT -8
^^ the point isn't implying that Western Ave is like Wilshire Blvd for any other reason than Western Ave has a commuter ridership that is more concerned with making good time than local service (for lack of other options). The suggestion and implication would be maybe if would take cues from Wilshire Blvd by eliminating some local capacity for more limited stop service, it doesn't have to last all night like the 720 because it does indeed drop off sooner because it is largely workers and families leaving/traveling to work or going home.
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Post by bzcat on Oct 7, 2011 16:47:17 GMT -8
One of the reality of politics in this city is that you can't take away car travel lane for transit vehicles so that means Western Ave is probably not feasible for bus way. I don't agree with this... just point out the obvious.
Metro is working on the Mayor V's task force study for top 5 BRT corridor candidates.. we'll see what they come up with in a few months.
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Post by ieko on Oct 7, 2011 21:15:01 GMT -8
Western is very busy, but it's a 2-lane road. So you run into a few problems.. reducing to 1-lane on Western would be really impractical because it's a serious artery of our street grid. So a dedicated lane wouldn't be feasible.
The Rapid bus program without the dedicated lane faces a nearly identical problem to what I've been pointing out about Pico, you actually get worse service, because most trips don't see a time savings. On a 2-lane road buses have difficulty passing each other, traffic just isn't flowing fast enough and because most trips are not from end-to-end the time savings are almost certainly lost, an additional factor is that you must also now walk farther to your intended destination or to catch a rapid bus. Does it really make sense not to stop at all stops when there is little to no times savings at the expense of additional capacity and frequency to the local route? I'm not so sure...
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Post by JerardWright on Oct 8, 2011 14:41:01 GMT -8
Western is very busy, but it's a 2-lane road. So you run into a few problems.. reducing to 1-lane on Western would be really impractical because it's a serious artery of our street grid. So a dedicated lane wouldn't be feasible. Western would make an excellent Streetcar corridor because of its boarding density and short trip lengths. Exactly the point, also a key statistic for this Western Avenue Rapid Line 757 service is average trip distance, is nearly identical to the Local 207 with a trip length of only 2.5 miles and it doesn't make too much of a time savings dent unless passengers are travelling a longer distance like over 5.5 miles, like a Line 704, 720 or 733. And with this information, if a decision were to come up like this again, I would go for replacing the Rapid buses with more Local service. This is one of the key factors that led to our Service Sector canceling Rapid Line 730 and replacing it with a peak-period limited stop service in Line 330. The ridership is there however the time savings and average rider trip length is no where needed for a Rapid service and it makes it more difficult to coordinate scheduling with the local Line 30 to even out the headways.
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Post by bluelineshawn on Oct 8, 2011 22:01:44 GMT -8
Considering that Expo is opening soon I'd say that it makes sense to wait awhile and see if travel patterns change. Also I think that part of the problems with the Rapid are that it wasn't setup well and the local and rapid stations are too close together, often at the same place. People tend to take whatever bus is next because you never know when the next bus is coming.
That said it could very well be that improving the local service and eliminating the Rapid (especially off peak) may be the way to go. I agree that's what it looks like.
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Post by wad on Oct 17, 2011 4:38:21 GMT -8
Wilshire is a unique street and there is no street in LA (or the rest of the USA) that deserves the amount of bus service that Wilshire boulevard gets. Rapid scheduled every 2 -5 minutes...is pretty much unheard of. Look at some of the streets near Wilshire: 16-Third, 18-6th/Whittier, 66-8th/E. Olympic -- 2-3 minute headways during the peak, 8-10 minutes middays. (In reality, it's really 10 minutes in the peak with 3-4 buses arriving at the same time.) I think Western is No. 4 or 5. The 720 corridor (18/20/720) is tops by far. Second is Vermont with 53,000 boardings as of 2009. Third is either Santa Monica or Venice. Western (207/757) is 36,000 boardings as of 2009.
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Post by bzcat on Oct 17, 2011 11:55:57 GMT -8
Isn't Van Nuys/Sepulveda (761) one of the top 5?
I think this is the order... 1. Wilshire 2. Vermont 3. Venice 4. Van Nuys 5. Western 6. Santa Monica (?)
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