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Post by gatewaygent on Nov 9, 2012 13:49:50 GMT -8
Thank you LAofAnaheim. You've jolted my wishful thinking into gear when you referenced Olympic Bl. getting LRT or HRT line. I've put that idea out there before. In fact, I had started a thread under 'The Dream' sub-head; it wasn't well received and one person did suggest it would make a better street car line.
I can see where the costs would be high going east. All those bridges connecting DTLA with East L.A. would need to be redone. The only one that is in the works is the 6th St. bridge. Wouldn't it be great if L.A./Metro had enough foresight to build it in a way where it could accommodate future LRT, HRT, or both under the roadway like the bridges in the East Coast?
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Post by gatewaygent on Nov 9, 2012 14:23:32 GMT -8
Has Metro started acknowledging what's going to happen with regards to the Pasadena route of the Gold Line once the Connector is up and running? Maybe there should be a move to get away from referring to it as the Pasadena Gold Line and just call it the Pasadena Line, Pasdena Branch, Pasadena Branch Line...something that doesn't reference Gold. With the advent of the Foothill extension, maybe the DTLA to Azusa route could be renamed the Azusa Branch Line. 'Branch' and 'Blue' both start with 'B'....
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Post by jdrcrasher on Nov 9, 2012 15:36:27 GMT -8
I think an Olympic blvd rail line should originate downtown, head west on Olympic (obviously lol), and turn northwest on Avenue of the Stars in Century City with terminus station at Constellation (and transfer point to the Purple Line).
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Post by LAofAnaheim on Nov 10, 2012 12:36:55 GMT -8
I think an Olympic blvd rail line should originate downtown, head west on Olympic (obviously lol), and turn northwest on Avenue of the Stars in Century City with terminus station at Constellation (and transfer point to the Purple Line). You're basically describing the 28 and 728 bus route. Also, the LADOT 534 does that route except it goes further west into Westwood. If there is another east-west rail line in Los Angeles, it would have to be Santa Monica boulevard. This would connect the Beverly Center, West Hollywood, Beverly Hills (ugh), Century City, West LA and Santa Monica. For Santa Monica, SM boulevard is more of their "spine" than Wilshire boulevard. But I do think Santa Monica boulevard will be covered between San Vicente/La Ceienega to La Brea with the eventual northern extension of the Crenshaw Line, which will be the most anticipated rail line for LA once the Purple Line is done going west. You'll see tremendous pressure by politicans and railfans wanting a northern extension of the Crenshaw Line via West Hollywood. |
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Post by jdrcrasher on Nov 10, 2012 16:04:25 GMT -8
LaofAnaheim, after seeing what happened to Measure J, doesn't sending a third line to Santa Monica (while its needed) seem unreasonable, especially when other major corridors like Venice Blvd and other areas of the city don't yet have rail?
BTW, how high is ridership on Lines 28 and 728?
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Post by LAofAnaheim on Nov 10, 2012 17:54:52 GMT -8
LaofAnaheim, after seeing what happened to Measure J, doesn't sending a third line to Santa Monica (while its needed) seem unreasonable, especially when other major corridors like Venice Blvd and other areas of the city don't yet have rail? BTW, how high is ridership on Lines 28 and 728? Santa Monica seems more reasonable to me. If the Santa Monica blvd route started in downtown, it would also include Silver Lake, which would add even more to ridership. Also, it's more dense than the Olympic corridor. Pico/Olympic should get some bus only lanes. I don't know about ridership on Pico or Olympic. |
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Post by gatewaygent on Nov 10, 2012 21:13:25 GMT -8
The old Silver Line concept.... I remember I used to suggest a western extension past the Santa Monica Red Line Station, but it was often bemoaned as something that was unnecessary because of the potential Purple Line extension (which thanks to Beverly Hills may or may not happen now).
I like the thought of the Westside being served by the pre-existing Red Line; the impending Puprple Line extension; a Crenshaw Line northern extension to Hollywood/Highland; and a line on Santa Monica Bl. to as far west as it can go. If successful high ridership is attained and maintained in this grid, maybe this could be replicated in the SGV with rail routes on Garvey Av., Valley Bl., Main St./Las Tunas Dr., and Rosemead Bl.
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Post by jdrcrasher on Nov 11, 2012 21:35:44 GMT -8
I like the thought of the Westside being served by the pre-existing Red Line; the impending Puprple Line extension; a Crenshaw Line northern extension to Hollywood/Highland; and a line on Santa Monica Bl. to as far west as it can go. If successful high ridership is attained and maintained in this grid, maybe this could be replicated in the SGV with rail routes on Garvey Av., Valley Bl., Main St./Las Tunas Dr., and Rosemead Bl. This may sound weird, especially since its not as busy as other major streets you mentioned, but ESPECIALLY Rosemead Blvd. it can act like a "405 Sepulveda Corridor East", connecting different lines with one cross town line ending in Long Beach. |
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Post by gatewaygent on Nov 12, 2012 0:18:55 GMT -8
Even if a line on Rosemead Bl./Lakewood Bl. connected the Pasadena Gold Line Sierra Madre Station with the Green Line Lakewood Station, it would be quite the accomplishment! We could call this phase 1. Phase 2 would be the Green Line Lakewood Station to the Lakewood Mall or maybe even Long Beach Airport. And this would be called the Light Blue Line? Copper? Obsidian? Lavender?
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Post by jdrcrasher on Nov 12, 2012 20:48:08 GMT -8
I would probably call it the Teal Line (dark blue), given it would run somewhat parallel to the Blue Line.
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Post by Alexis Kasperavičius on Nov 13, 2012 8:18:10 GMT -8
How about this one:
The Blue line opened first, and it's tracks were numbered "1" and "2." While the Green line is connected to the Blue line, it's not for revenue service, so I assume those tracks are "1" and "2" also.
The Gold line is completely separate and it has tracks "1" and "2" as well.
The Expo line, because it shares tracks with the Blue line, has tracks "3" and "4."
When the regional connector opens, does the Goldline Eastside extension become "3" and "4" or will it keep it's number designation. Or, do we get tracks "5" and "6" (to East LA) and "7" and "8" (to Pasadena)?
How does this numbering work?
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Post by gatewaygent on Nov 13, 2012 11:45:04 GMT -8
In the words of Kelly Bundy: The mind wobbles.
I have no idea how this will work out, but let's use some creative reasoning/logic; and yes, I'll be going deep into left field for this so really none of it will be reasonable or logical.... Given: The purpose of the Connector is to create through-running east-west and north-south lines. Given: The Blue Line was originally conceived of as a single line, Long Beach-Pasadena. Given: The East L.A. branch of the Gold Line is the alternative route to the East L.A. Red (now Purple) Line. Given: The Expo Line is not the alternative to the Red (now Purple) Line. Therefore, The East L.A. branch of the Gold Line shall be renumbered tracks "3" and "4" and collaterally, the Expo Line becomes Gold and the Pasadena branch of the current Gold Line configuration becomes Blue.
A future Pasadena-Santa Monica Line will require the addition of a track "5" and "6" moniker to the designated tracks on the guide way; and the color designation "Aqua" is officially inaugurated. Pasadena will have one-seat rides to two (2) different beaches.
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Post by Elson on Nov 13, 2012 22:30:07 GMT -8
From what I have heard from Metro rail operations people, post-regional connector lines will be Long Beach to Azusa and Santa Monica to East LA in regular service, with provisions for Azusa-Santa Monica or Long Beach-East LA trains for special events (USC football games, for example) or peak hour service.
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Post by transitfan on Nov 14, 2012 7:59:20 GMT -8
From what I have heard from Metro rail operations people, post-regional connector lines will be Long Beach to Azusa and Santa Monica to East LA in regular service, with provisions for Azusa-Santa Monica or Long Beach-East LA trains for special events (USC football games, for example) or peak hour service. Good to hear. I wonder if the "Little Tokyo" junction (I just made that up, by no means an official name) will still allow for East L. A.-Pasadena (Azuza) service (could be useful for the Rose Parade/Rose Bowl and possibly other events). |
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Post by gatewaygent on Nov 14, 2012 11:12:07 GMT -8
From what I have heard from Metro rail operations people, post-regional connector lines will be Long Beach to Azusa and Santa Monica to East LA in regular service, with provisions for Azusa-Santa Monica or Long Beach-East LA trains for special events (USC football games, for example) or peak hour service. Good to hear. I wonder if the "Little Tokyo" junction (I just made that up, by no means an official name) will still allow for East L. A.-Pasadena (Azuza) service (could be useful for the Rose Parade/Rose Bowl and possibly other events). I'm sure that could still work out if the driver pulls into the station, gets out of the forward cab, alerts a Metro operator to hit the switch so the train goes to LAUS instead of East L.A., and walks over to the back cab which would becomes the new forward cab to Pasadena/Azusa. During this 1 or 2 minute interlude, people could board or exit. |
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Post by Elson on Nov 14, 2012 12:33:29 GMT -8
Good to hear. I wonder if the "Little Tokyo" junction (I just made that up, by no means an official name) will still allow for East L. A.-Pasadena (Azuza) service (could be useful for the Rose Parade/Rose Bowl and possibly other events). I'm sure that could still work out if the driver pulls into the station, gets out of the forward cab, alerts a Metro operator to hit the switch so the train goes to LAUS instead of East L.A., and walks over to the back cab which would becomes the new forward cab to Pasadena/Azusa. During this 1 or 2 minute interlude, people could board or exit. From what I've seen in the track schematic, not possible for one-seat travel East LA to Pasadena (ironically, the route as it is today). The maneuver you described would totally tie up the line if headways get shorter. Not practical from an operational standpoint. |
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Post by transitfan on Nov 15, 2012 6:46:44 GMT -8
I'm sure that could still work out if the driver pulls into the station, gets out of the forward cab, alerts a Metro operator to hit the switch so the train goes to LAUS instead of East L.A., and walks over to the back cab which would becomes the new forward cab to Pasadena/Azusa. During this 1 or 2 minute interlude, people could board or exit. From what I've seen in the track schematic, not possible for one-seat travel East LA to Pasadena (ironically, the route as it is today). The maneuver you described would totally tie up the line if headways get shorter. Not practical from an operational standpoint. Bummer  Too bad they can't keep the surface tracks for such a move, and then build the underground junction and merge the tracks north of Little Tokyo station, but I guess that is not practical. |
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Post by gatewaygent on Nov 24, 2012 23:37:47 GMT -8
Metro is going to go thru some serious growing pains once this all pans out. With the nebulous state of whether or not the WSAB/PEROW will be the third line to use Little Tokyo Station or merely roll on an oddly positioned track set, things will only get worse.
Metro really needs to get on the ball and coordinate these projects so that whatever configuration results, it runs smoothly and doesn't create time-synch issues/bottle necks.
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Post by bzcat on Apr 6, 2015 14:23:48 GMT -8
Metro came out with its proposal: thesource.metro.net/2015/04/06/powerpoint-metro-staff-proposal-to-rename-rail-and-brt-lines/A - Blue Line + Gold Line Pasadena Foothill B - Red Line C - Purple Line D - Green Line existing version E - Expo Line + Gold Line East LA F - Skipped G - Orange Line (all three lines... no split designation like the new D/L+K Line) H - Skipped I - Skipped J - Silver Line (no alternative letters for the Union Station-El Monte short line) K - Crenshaw Line + Green Line South Bay L - Green Line Norwalk to Century Aviation (likely to 96th station eventually) First thought... not bad. I personally would still recommend a logical name based letter (e.g. W for Wilshire, E for Expo, L for Long Beach etc) but the new letter name combined with existing color scheme is excellent foundation for the expanding rail network. Second thought... different letter for different destination on the Green Line but not Orange Line or Silver Line? Lack of consistency even before they implement the change  |
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Post by Philip on Apr 6, 2015 14:54:48 GMT -8
I like the map. A few notes:
--The D line is unneccesary; Redondo Beach does not need two rail lines running to it (at least not until service gets extended south to the Galleria and beyond). Keep the letter D designation, but use it for what the map identifies as the L service.
--Since the Orange Line is already split between two termini (Warner and Chatsworth), it could probably use another letter to differentiate the two.
--Though the Regional Connector routing has more or less been decided (Long Beach-Pasadena, Santa Monica-East L.A.), letters and numbers open up many possibilities. Such as:
A line - Long Beach to Azusa
E line - Santa Monica to East L.A.
M line - Santa Monica to Pasadena
N line - Long Beach to East L.A.
Otherwise, looks solid!
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Post by bzcat on Apr 6, 2015 15:29:05 GMT -8
D line is necessary at least initially because Metro is likely going to need to share rail cars between Green Line and Crenshaw line so you need equal headways on all three segments (Crenshaw-Century/Aviation + Norwalk-Century/Aviation + Redondo Beach-Century Aviation).
The other missing info here is frequency... We don't really know what Metro plan on running when Crenshaw is interlined with Green Line South Bay. So it's premature to worry about how many letters the South Bay stations get.
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Post by thanks4goingmetro on Jan 21, 2016 13:24:21 GMT -8
Not sure if you guys have seen this, for giggles I altered the new Metro rail map to show how service really functions on Blue, Orange, Silver Lines here:
I also agree the Orange Line would be better off as two different lines as described by map for ease of use.
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