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Post by roadtrainer on Aug 12, 2008 13:18:21 GMT -8
Well I got to Union Station Gold line platform yesterday and several politicians were backing the tax for transit and the Union were backing this measure...just like i said, It means union construction jobs and union employees to run the Job. Don't forget then unions have alot of power, They got Grey Davis elected and Mayor Villaragossa elected too!
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simon
New Member
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Post by simon on Aug 12, 2008 18:24:01 GMT -8
Obviously the tax is worth supporting, no matter the odds, but a two thirds vote threshold is a brutal bar. Most two-thirds votes get passed over only token opposition from generic anti-tax groups and people who vote no on everything, not multiple political leaders with real sway and real vote operations.
It's not hopeless, but if you wanted me to make a prediction I'd say we're in for a slow-motion car crash, knowing how everything is going to turn out in advance but largely powerless to stop it. Lord I hope I'm wrong and the big election turnout somehow gets this through.
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Post by kenalpern on Aug 13, 2008 19:29:58 GMT -8
Well, it's been brutal and bruising and reeeeeeally ugly, but this sales tax appears to be moving past the countywide and statewide hurdles. It's now moving towards those who favor being FOR something to try to pull it forward.
The two-thirds hurdle really is huge and unfair, but it's our reality. Hopefully, both congestion and the price of gas will encourage its passage. Otherwise, it certainly gives a nice precedent for it to potentially pass on a future attempt.
I really do want to give it my all, but should this fail by a relatively small margin (especially with those awful clowns in Sacramento pushing their own sales tax hike), we can revisit this in the future.
Still, those willing to vote FOR something will be attracted by fixes to our freeways, a countywide rail network (including light rail connections to LAX and towards Ontario Airport). I share all the concerns mentioned by simon, but like him I want to give it my all to see just how far we can get this promoted.
If those politicians opposed to it for their own personal reasons will at least have the decency to oppose it with only a faint gesture, we stand a good chance. For example, I can't imagine the Gold Line Authority opposing this measure (which means Antonovich and Fasana would have to be quiet in their opposition), nor can I imagine the Green Line Coalition opposing this measure (which means Knabe would have to be quiet in his opposition).
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simon
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Post by simon on Aug 13, 2008 19:40:05 GMT -8
Today was a good sign. Still many hurdles left, including the biggest of all, but one of the positive aspects of today's proposal was a genuine amendment that might calm some of the valley fears. Bottleneck Blog reports:
"The other amendment to the bill -- and in my view, the one that you should note -- requires that the MTA give the state Legislature one year's prior notice if the MTA board decides to change the spending plan for expected sales tax revenues. In other words, if the MTA board wants to take money from one project and give it to another, they have to let the Legislature know way ahead of time so anyone who wants to cry foul can do so."
I'm sure the SGV and SFV officials will still oppose the bill, but now at least they know that Metro can't, for instance, just take that billion dollars set aside for a Sepulveda line and throw it somewhere else behind the scenes without the Valley or other officials being able to stop them. Something like this may do a lot to reduce the heat of the opposition.
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Post by kenalpern on Aug 13, 2008 21:48:21 GMT -8
Exactly--the City of L.A. will have to convince the rest of the county that it will do the right thing by everyone. After all, widening the I-5 and SR-60 freeways benefit Angelenos as much as extending the Wilshire Subway will benefit SGV and Eastside residents.
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Post by jejozwik on Aug 14, 2008 9:56:09 GMT -8
The two-thirds hurdle really is huge and unfair, but it's our reality. Hopefully, both congestion and the price of gas will encourage its passage. you know what would be really awful? if oil companies were watching what is playing out in los angeles, and in interest to there bottom line in the future they lower the price of gas for the entire month of november. lord i hope that does not turn into reality... good news on the vote though!
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Post by jejozwik on Aug 14, 2008 10:53:28 GMT -8
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Post by jejozwik on Sept 13, 2008 13:41:52 GMT -8
im interested to see how people will take the recent accident in regards to the .5% sales tax measure and HSR.
i fear they wont be doing too well now
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Post by darrell on Sept 13, 2008 19:31:17 GMT -8
go la weekly, your the best I previously wrote, Bus advocates call for lower fares and more service in the face of limited operations funds and rising costs. The solution is a bigger pot, which is where 20% of the sales tax would generate $7,880 million for bus operations over 30 years, a 70% annual increase from existing (Draft LRTP) levels. The Weekly also confused minimum amounts with total amounts allocated to projects. Also see Metro's information page.
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Post by roadtrainer on Sept 23, 2008 9:10:14 GMT -8
;D Okay guys and Gals: It is time to quit b-tching and get behind the sales tax. Not everybody is going to like it, but grant you it is better than nothing! If you think that Arnold is going to quit raiding the transportation fund then you've in LA-LA LAND. but lets get out of the complainer wagon and help push and pull to victory the Measure R. Today in the Press-Telegram there is an add for the Measure R, it is a full page add asking for support of Measure R and it deals with the area of Issues of the Southeast L.A. County. You'll find it on page A7.
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Post by kenalpern on Sept 23, 2008 16:11:54 GMT -8
I'm glad that the Press-Telegram and other newspapers will have such ads, and I hope that the business and union lobbies recognize that Prop. R is the best way to save L.A. County during the next few tough years.
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Post by roadtrainer on Sept 23, 2008 17:46:55 GMT -8
I'm glad that the Press-Telegram and other newspapers will have such ads, and I hope that the business and union lobbies recognize that Prop. R is the best way to save L.A. County during the next few tough years. Well we know that the auto club is on board , so are the unions and I got a mailer about Measure R from the MTA today. Nice pictures and a good presentation about 10 pages long.
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Post by jejozwik on Sept 23, 2008 19:28:35 GMT -8
Well we know that the auto club is on board , so are the unions and I got a mailer about Measure R from the MTA today. Nice pictures and a good presentation about 10 pages long. the mta is not going to have to stop mailing those out because they were printed with tax money now too are they?
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Post by Transit Coalition on Sept 24, 2008 16:25:53 GMT -8
Well we know that the auto club is on board , so are the unions and I got a mailer about Measure R from the MTA today. Nice pictures and a good presentation about 10 pages long. Metro is not going to have to stop mailing those out because they were printed with tax dollars? Are they? Metro has a legal obligation to tell voters what it is doing and and actions that Metro is proposing. What Metro cannot do is take a position or tell voters what position they should take. So, again, they can spend funds to educate and to publicize a ballot initiative, but they can't tell you how to vote or what actions you might take. I hope this is clear.
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Post by darrell on Sept 25, 2008 21:54:13 GMT -8
Governor Arnold Schwarzenegger signed AB 2321 (Feuer) today. So Measure R is on for November!
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Post by kenalpern on Sept 25, 2008 22:09:22 GMT -8
AWESOME!!!!
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Post by jejozwik on Sept 26, 2008 13:45:38 GMT -8
now lets worry about the 2/3s
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Post by erict on Sept 27, 2008 11:55:09 GMT -8
I am amazed that measure R has gotten this far. I hope it passes. I know I will vote for it and encourage everyone else to as well.
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Post by Gokhan on Sept 28, 2008 21:49:52 GMT -8
Does the "R" in Measure R stand for rail? Anyone knows? Even if it doesn't, I like to call it Measure Rail. I received Metro's information guide on Measure R, a nice booklet, addressed to general postal customer, on Saturday (yesterday). And the mother of all rail-transit projects, the project that will bring the railroad to the west end of the world -- the Expo Line to Santa Monica -- is No. 1A on the list. Not hard to understand why all the Expo NIMBYs are against this measure.
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Post by Gokhan on Oct 5, 2008 21:08:29 GMT -8
It turns out that the "R" in Measure R officially stands for three things: Traffic Relief, Rail extensions, and Reduce foreign-oil dependenceHere is the official ballot description: To: Synchronize traffic signals; Repair potholes; Extend light rail with airport connections; Improve freeway traffic flow (5, 10, 14, 60, 101, 110, 138, 210, 405, 605, 710); Keep senior/student/disabled fares low; Provide clean–fuel buses; Expand subway/Metrolink/bus service; Dedicate millions for community traffic relief; Shall Los Angeles County’s sales tax increase one–half cent for 30 years with independent audits, public review of expenditures, all locally controlled?View a sample ballot here. Or you can generate the ballot for your particular locality here. And these are the destructive politicians who are campaigning against Measure R: - (East) County Supervisor Gloria Molina
- (North) County Supervisor Michael Antonovich
- (South) County Supervisor Don Knabe
- Pasadena Mayor Bill Bogaard
- Long Beach Councilman Gary Delong
- Sherman Oaks Homeowners's Association President Richard H. Close
- El Monte Mayor Juventino "J" Gomez
- Duarte Mayor John Fasana
- Glendale Mayor Ara Najarian
Perhaps, the Westside (Expo Phase 2) and Mid-City (Crenshaw) rail projects are on top of the list in front of Gold Phase 2+, but does that mean that these tunnel-visioned politicians should help put the rail-transit projects as well as all the freeway improvements in LA 30 years behind?
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Post by jejozwik on Oct 6, 2008 5:25:44 GMT -8
el monte mayor? what the heck, his cities only clam to fame is the fact that it is the terminus of the el monte busway. hes against more transit.... what a fool.
what a moment... pasadena, long beach, sherman oaks, el monte? so the cities who have transit now what a monopoly of it? whats going on here?
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Post by Gokhan on Oct 6, 2008 8:10:04 GMT -8
el monte mayor? what the heck, his cities only clam to fame is the fact that it is the terminus of the el monte busway. hes against more transit.... what a fool. what a moment... pasadena, long beach, sherman oaks, el monte? so the cities who have transit now what a monopoly of it? whats going on here? That's correct. Mid-City and the Westside have no rail, wheras these cities already have a combination of Metro or Metrolink Rail. They want more before Mid-City and the Westside get any. Or, perhaps, they are plain NIMBYs. Or, perhaps, they only care about their own personal agenda, such as pretending to reach to their constituents. Hopefully, LA County voters won't buy their arguments. Measure R is the biggest funding opportunity for transit in decades and decades to come. Let's not make it one of the many failed transit measures. Also, ironically, in the past usually majority voters have killed such measures. And, now, it's a minority politician (Molina) who is going against it. Again, it's just about personal agenda, not minding to destroy so many benefits to the whole County. It's a shame that such unintelligent hypocrites get elected.
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Post by jejozwik on Oct 6, 2008 8:32:22 GMT -8
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Post by Gokhan on Oct 9, 2008 11:31:36 GMT -8
Actual cost of Measure R
Critics like Gloria Molina have claimed that Measure R will impose a burden on low-income people in their neighborhood.
In order to find out how much burden this will be, I considered the extreme case of a person making a living by collecting cans. Measure R is calculated to cost approximately $25 a year per person on the average. So, this is roughly one empty aluminum can a day. I think this is not really any burden for the can collector.
One empty aluminum can a day = Brand-new Los Angeles with a comprehensive rail-transit system, affordable and efficient public transit, and improved freeways
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Post by Gokhan on Oct 9, 2008 21:09:58 GMT -8
Los Angeles Times endorses Measure R.
This might be our only chance to get rail transit built in LA. We can only achieve this by making people realize how much they are getting for how little -- something some ignorant-as-usual politicians failed to realize.Editorial
Yes on Measure R It's a tough time to seek a tax hike, but Measure R is worth it. October 9, 2008Los Angeles is as famous for its traffic congestion as it is for its sunsets and palm trees, and it has paid a steep price, in smog and gridlock, for its love affair with cars. Belated attempts to devise a functional public transit system have run up against a shortage of funding and a steep hike in construction costs, producing only a patchwork of street buses and light-rail lines, as well as a single dedicated busway and a single subway line -- which don't connect well with one another, not to mention with the parts of the county where they're most needed. Measure R would help change that. The measure would impose a sales tax increase of half a cent on the dollar in Los Angeles County, raising the rate to 8.75% (tying Alameda County for the highest sales tax rate in California). The money would pay for a wide range of transportation projects, including an extension of the subway toward the Westside, light-rail extensions through the San Gabriel Valley, dedicated busways in the San Fernando Valley and a host of highway improvements. Overall, 65% of the money would go to transit, 20% to highways and 15% to cities for such things as fixing potholes and synchronizing traffic signals. The official opposition to Measure R comes mainly from politicians from far-flung parts of the county who claim that they wouldn't get their fair share of the tax money; they tend to favor a regional distribution scheme in which funds would be split evenly. That's not just parochial, it's naive. A well-designed transportation network relieves bottlenecks in places where demand is greatest, and such high-density corridors aren't evenly distributed on the map. The projects to be funded by Measure R have been well chosen to maximize efficiency and thus give taxpayers the best bang for their bucks regardless of where they live. County residents tend to commute far from their homes, and they would see a traffic benefit even if nothing is built in their neighborhoods; they'd also enjoy improvements in air quality. Although big cities often use sales taxes to pay for transportation improvements, it's not an ideal method. We'd rather see these projects funded by motorists, via higher vehicle registration fees or gas taxes. That would properly place the burden of relieving our traffic and smog problems on those who cause them. Sales taxes, by contrast, hurt low-income people the most and do nothing to discourage driving. Unfortunately, that seems to be the only politically tenable course. Tax increases require a two-thirds vote for approval, and polls show that the sales tax is the only funding source that comes close to reaching that level of public acceptance. Measure R's timing is problematic -- voters will be understandably reluctant to approve a tax hike during an economic downturn. Yet, if it fails, it might be many years before another such measure comes along, during which gridlock and pollution will only worsen. L.A. County residents have a chance to turn our Third World transit network into something more befitting a world-class metropolitan area, and they should take it by approving Measure R. Discuss "Yes on Measure R"
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Post by jejozwik on Oct 10, 2008 8:34:36 GMT -8
interesting effects if metro does not get there measure R passed. not sure how valid these are, but it sort of makes sense metro rider la
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Post by masonite on Oct 12, 2008 6:29:59 GMT -8
interesting effects if metro does not get there measure R passed. not sure how valid these are, but it sort of makes sense metro rider laI'm disappointed that the Measure R campaign is so weak so far. People are already voting via absentee and there has been nothing, not even a website for Measure R. Ace Smith is a sharp organizer, but I suppose he is really hampered by having no funds. It is really now or never for this as the future of public transit in LA really depends on it.
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Post by jejozwik on Oct 15, 2008 5:18:32 GMT -8
6:14 am on ktla channel 5 i just saw a commercial for measure R. not so bad. was about to try to type a sinops. but i found the youtube link www.youtube.com/watch?v=VOkdMaPSbv4
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Post by bobdavis on Oct 15, 2008 20:53:21 GMT -8
Who was it who said "The perfect is the enemy of the good"? I usually go along with John Fasana (member of the Duarte City Council; I lived in Duarte for many years), but on this measure I'll part company. I'm voting yes on "R" and encouraging friends and family to do likewise.
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Post by whitmanlam on Oct 15, 2008 21:30:40 GMT -8
Yeah, I haven't seen any ads or media spotlight on Measure R. It seems like it's being buried by all the other ballot measures .... even that Chicken Coup Regulation Proposition is getting more press .... damn that hurts ...
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