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Post by culvercitylocke on Nov 26, 2016 23:13:24 GMT -8
Always good to make transit harder to use for the stellar reason that policy wonks and interested parties are bored with using street names to navigate a city.
And we wonder why ridership is declining when utility of the system is regarded as a drawback rather than a virtue.
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Post by gatewaygent on Nov 28, 2016 21:18:50 GMT -8
Metro wants your opinion on the new station names. You can give your input here. It takes less than a minute. My votes were: - Little Tokyo/Arts District (same name as the old station)
- Broadway
- Bunker Hill
With the potential of each a WSAB/PEROW station and a Red/Purple Line station in the Arts District, I'd reduce 'Little Tokyo/Arts District' to just 'Little Tokyo' and save the other half for a "Central Arts District" Station and a "Riparian Arts District" Station. |
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Post by metrocenter on Jan 9, 2017 10:04:16 GMT -8
Happy New Year!
2017 is the year Angeli, the Metro Regional Connector TBM, will dig twin tunnels along 2nd Street in Downtown L.A.
According to Metro, Angeli will begin the first tunnel in January and will take about 5.5 months to complete it. Immediately afterward, Metro will be create the second tunnel, to be completed around the end of the year.
Contractors have been setting up Angeli at the pit at First/Alameda since October.
Of course, pile installation and work on station boxes continues, as well. This should be a great year of progress!
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expo
Junior Member
Posts: 71 
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Post by expo on Jan 9, 2017 12:15:32 GMT -8
Why don't they dig both tunnels at the same time? Is it just so they don't have to lease two TBMs? It seems leasing two for half the time should be less expense than one for double the time, given all the other costs needed to support digging...
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Post by JerardWright on Jan 9, 2017 15:05:27 GMT -8
Why don't they dig both tunnels at the same time? Is it just so they don't have to lease two TBMs? It seems leasing two for half the time should be less expense than one for double the time, given all the other costs needed to support digging... Yes given the amount of actual tunneling work for the segment along 2nd Street will only be a mile between Hope Street and Alameda, it makes more fiscal sense to do that because you only need one work crew for a consistent amount of work over that full year rather than two crews a shorter time which ends up costing more for such a short timeframe. If the tunneling were longer than 2.0 miles per direction then multiple TBM's would be used. But for this arrangement it makes more sense to go with one. The Crenshaw/LAX tunneling is done with only one TBM as well and is making good time on the construction. |
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Post by metrocenter on Jan 10, 2017 12:29:35 GMT -8
Why don't they dig both tunnels at the same time? Is it just so they don't have to lease two TBMs? It seems leasing two for half the time should be less expense than one for double the time, given all the other costs needed to support digging... I actually don't see one year as too long for boring the tunnels. It took, what, 2-3 years just to get utilities relocated? If anything went long, it was that. And, utility relocation was much more of a 'blocking event' than tunneling is. Station box construction will continue even if the tunnel is a bit delayed. But nothing could happen before utilities were relocated. As Jerard points out, doing two at once would have resulted in much higher costs (for TBM lease and for labor), with not that much benefit. |
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Post by culvercitylocke on Jan 10, 2017 15:55:46 GMT -8
And labor is a consideration, look at the Alaskan way viaduct tunnel, they operate in two five day twelve hour shifts, rather than in a 24/7 schedule because there are not enough skilled personnel to operate that many shifts on the tunneling machine. thesource.metro.net/2016/10/11/metro-receives-unsolicited-proposal-that-could-accelerate-several-measure-m-projects-four-additional-mega-project-proposals-under-review/I imagine a big part of whatever the above linked big new plan submitted to metro last fall is going to be about maximizing labor skills and experience, so you train extra experts on administering utility relocation expeditiously and deploy them nonstop, you pay to train extra Tbm operators, so you can run parallel tbms or 24/7 shifts knowing you'll employ them on multiple consecutive projects and make back your investment in training by collecting early/under budget bonuses. The other big part of such a proposal is probably standardizing station construction and maximizing equipment investment so that TBMs can be reused and constantly deployed on projects, but I'm guessing a lot of the proposal is about administrative and labor expertise and deploying and exploiting and expanding that expertise resource. |
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Post by metrocenter on Jan 30, 2017 16:48:18 GMT -8
At the January board meeting, the life of project budget was increased by $199 million, from $1.55 billion to $1.75 billion. Much of this increase was due to Metro's failure to anticipate the complexity and duration of utility relocations.
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Post by gatewaygent on Jan 31, 2017 17:38:45 GMT -8
Damn, too bad it wasn't for the re-addition of 4th/5th St. Station with an entrance into the Bonaventure. However, if Metro tried doing that now, I'm sure it would delay the project by at least 2 years as they figured out how to re-incorporate it.
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Post by jdrcrasher on Jan 31, 2017 18:44:10 GMT -8
You know, growing up I used to just love staring at the Bonaventure hotel. Those beautiful curves!
However, as I've come to gain more knowledge of (and experience and appreciate) what pedestrian friendly environments are all about, the more 50/50 I am about its existence. In fact I would not lose any sleep if the owner announced tomorrow it was demoing the place and building a supertall in its place, and I hope to live to see the day when that actually happens.
Here's why:
1. It's sheer size. I never really grasped just how large the thing's footprint actually is until realizing it's lot size is the same size as the one that houses US Bank and Mellon (if you exclude Hope street of course). In fact if you were to just cut off the southwestern portion of the podium, you can practically fit a tower the size of US Bank on it.
2. It's complete lack of streetfront amenities.
3. Even if there were any streetfront shops restaurants and retail, the idiotic pedestrian walkways discourage any street interaction that would exist. And really, it's not like we live in Minneapolis...
And lastly, It's one of the few physical obstacles literally standing in the way of Metro using, at the very least a portion, of the Belmont Tunnel.
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Post by culvercitylocke on Jan 31, 2017 22:22:56 GMT -8
When I was at USC, my girlfriend and I were in an art theory class together, a required class we both needed as we had different art minors. In it we read an incredible essay about the bonaventure and its architecture, but it was almost all about the möbius space interior of the hotel. That weekend we hopped on the dash, rode downtown and spent about twenty minutes walking around the bonaventure trying to figure out how to get in he hotel to see the fabulous interior architecture. Eventually we succeeded and rode the elevator to have a look at the view, but I don't remember a thing about what the interior was like, only he block after block of fortress of concrete walls filling our field of vision that was keeping us out.
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Post by gatewaygent on Feb 1, 2017 13:31:07 GMT -8
I haven't seen the inside of this hotel in years. I remember there was a bar in the lobby. In the 80's to early 90's there was Fantasia, a nightclub/disco. The building was featured in the sitcom It's a Living. Other than it's foreboding nature, I gotta agree that there's nothing really special about it. I guess that because of the five (5) glass cylinders that make up the hotel, it can be classified as a 'pretty eyesore.'
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Post by metrocenter on Feb 15, 2017 14:58:52 GMT -8
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Post by gatewaygent on Feb 16, 2017 11:29:39 GMT -8
The Subway Terminal building station is going to start to look like a great option for LRV storage. What if at the junction where the tunnel and the Connector tracks meet there were a roundhouse to orient LRV's into and out of the Subway Terminal? Since it would only be used early in the morning to bring out the trains and late in the evening to store them, it wouldn't interfere with daily day-time operations.
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Post by johanragle on Feb 16, 2017 12:40:02 GMT -8
The Subway Terminal building station is going to start to look like a great option for LRV storage. What if at the junction where the tunnel and the Connector tracks meet there were a roundhouse to orient LRV's into and out of the Subway Terminal? Since it would only be used early in the morning to bring out the trains and late in the evening to store them, it wouldn't interfere with daily day-time operations. Didn't the final regional connector design preclude any use of the remaining portion of the Belmont tunnel by not including any provisions for a future connection? |
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Post by thanks4goingmetro on Feb 16, 2017 13:45:38 GMT -8
The Subway Terminal building station is going to start to look like a great option for LRV storage. What if at the junction where the tunnel and the Connector tracks meet there were a roundhouse to orient LRV's into and out of the Subway Terminal? Since it would only be used early in the morning to bring out the trains and late in the evening to store them, it wouldn't interfere with daily day-time operations. Didn't the final regional connector design preclude any use of the remaining portion of the Belmont tunnel by not including any provisions for a future connection? Correct. Also, not to forget the Bonaventure's foundation is literally standing in the way of the Belmont tunnel. I think the cut and cover TBM exit site is at Flower between 4th and 5th (I walk this way everyday from work) which would complicate matters even more because its essentially a fortified underground box being constructed with no method of modification. |
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Post by gatewaygent on Feb 17, 2017 1:12:19 GMT -8
An underground roundhouse is something that probably should have been mentioned during the planning stages. I'm probably mentioning it way too late. Oh well, it was worth a shot.
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Post by metrocenter on Mar 30, 2017 7:01:25 GMT -8
For those who haven't been keeping track, we have three future Metro Rail projects for Downtown LA, either under construction or in planning:
* the Regional Connector (of course)
* the Red Line extension to the Arts District, along with rail yard improvements
* the WSAB (West Santa Ana Branch) Line to Southeast LA (Huntington Park, etc.), in conjunction with the LinkUS project (multi-track bridge over 101 Fwy).
The Red Line extension will add stops along Santa Fe at 1st, 3rd and/or 6th.
The WSAB Line will most likely have a stop at 3rd/Traction and another at 7th/Alameda before connecting to the Blue Line. (But other options are being considered.)
The WSAB essentially creates a second "downtown connector". Will be interesting how that affects operations.
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Post by metrocenter on Mar 30, 2017 7:18:45 GMT -8
Of course my ideal situation would be to branch the Purple Line at 7th/Metro to continue eastward, to 7th/Main, 7th/Alameda, and then to the Santa Fe stations/yard and Union Station. This would create a loop for our HRT system, allowing smoother turnbacks.
But now I'm really off-topic!
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Post by thanks4goingmetro on Mar 30, 2017 11:53:44 GMT -8
Was on Source Metro yesterday and saw that TBM "Angeli" has already bored more than 1,100 feet and should be done with both tunnels by late 2018. When I'm out to lunch at work I'm seeing more activity between 4th and 5th on Flower St where the TBM is to reemerge and the tunnels will be linked. Sorry no pics.
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Post by metrocenter on Mar 30, 2017 14:15:56 GMT -8
Here's a link for the story in The Source.
Also see this story from three weeks ago on TunnelBuilder.com. LOL at all the europeanisms in the text.
There is indeed a lot of activity on Flower Street. Between 4th and 5th, they are working on decking for cut-and-cover. According to the engineering drawings, the "TBM Reception Pit" will be located just south of the intersection at 4th/Flower.
Then there is the big closure of 6th Street. Starting in June, 6th Street between Hope and the 110 Freeway will be closed completely, for six months! It's supposedly for decking, but a full closure seems extreme to me. The plans show a double-crossover directly below 6th/Flower. So I guess they need lots of space to work with. Interestingly, the construction notice doesn't say anything about closing Flower Street. So maybe they will be emptying the box from the east and west of the intersection, on 6th street. |
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Post by transitfan on Mar 31, 2017 6:35:53 GMT -8
Here's a link for the story in The Source.
Also see this story from three weeks ago on TunnelBuilder.com. LOL at all the europeanisms in the text.
There is indeed a lot of activity on Flower Street. Between 4th and 5th, they are working on decking for cut-and-cover. According to the engineering drawings, the "TBM Reception Pit" will be located just south of the intersection at 4th/Flower.
Then there is the big closure of 6th Street. Starting in June, 6th Street between Hope and the 110 Freeway will be closed completely, for six months! It's supposedly for decking, but a full closure seems extreme to me. The plans show a double-crossover directly below 6th/Flower. So I guess they need lots of space to work with. Interestingly, the construction notice doesn't say anything about closing Flower Street. So maybe they will be emptying the box from the east and west of the intersection, on 6th street. I wonder if the crossover at 6th/Flower is the already-exisiting crossover north of 7th St/Metro Center station that is in front of the tail tracks. I think the Regional Connector plans call for a pocket track further north. |
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Post by Philip on Mar 31, 2017 8:49:13 GMT -8
Are any provisions being made for a possible future 5th Street station?
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Post by joemagruder on Apr 1, 2017 6:37:05 GMT -8
What happens to used tunnel boring machines? Each one seems to be specially constructed for the job (diameter, soil types... I guess)?
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Post by masonite on Apr 1, 2017 8:36:50 GMT -8
What happens to used tunnel boring machines? Each one seems to be specially constructed for the job (diameter, soil types... I guess)? I believe they reuse some parts into a new machine and recycle the rest of the material. |
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Post by thanks4goingmetro on Apr 1, 2017 17:48:14 GMT -8
Can't remember where I read this (supplemental EIR?) but a potential 5th/Flower won't be precluded by the double crossovers.
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Post by metrocenter on May 3, 2017 5:53:49 GMT -8
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Post by usmc1401 on May 3, 2017 8:18:07 GMT -8
Looks like the 110 not the 101.
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Post by metrocenter on May 3, 2017 10:58:06 GMT -8
Looks like the 110 not the 101.
Yep, corrected. Thanks.
Metro's fact sheet actually states that the closure is for two purposes: (1) removal of utilities, and (2) installation of piles.
Here are the details of the closure:
- Northbound offramp to 6th Street will lead to a single lane which will lead to NB Figueroa.
- Southbound offramp to 6th Street will be closed completely.
- 6th Street will be open to local traffic only on certain segments between Figueroa and Hope.
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Post by metrocenter on May 10, 2017 6:02:44 GMT -8
Second/Spring is now reopened to traffic.
Pedestrians and cars have been unable to pass through Second Street for several months as the station box was being excavated.
Very soon, the TBM Angeli should be passing through that station box for the first time. It is currently heading west from Little Tokyo.
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