|
|
Post by LAofAnaheim on Apr 12, 2007 14:53:25 GMT -8
Can we start advocating a Dodger Shuttle from the Chinatown station to run before & after games? Can't this service be funded by MTA or the Dodgers? When was the last shuttle? Was it before the Gold Line was built?
|
|
|
|
Post by whitmanlam on Apr 12, 2007 16:01:15 GMT -8
I think a shuttle from Union Station to Dodger Stadium would be better.
It's about the same distance to the stadium and it offers more connections to trains / buses / subway, etc.
|
|
|
|
Post by LAofAnaheim on Apr 12, 2007 16:08:26 GMT -8
I honestly don't care where the shuttle eminates from, but we need to involve public transit in here. It's pathetic that it's easier for me to take public transit to Angel stadium via Metrolink/Amtrak, but I cannot do the same for Dodger stadium, which is 3 miles from my place in downtown.
|
|
|
|
Post by tonyw79sfv on Apr 12, 2007 17:45:38 GMT -8
|
|
|
|
Post by bluelineshawn on Apr 12, 2007 20:19:58 GMT -8
There's no incentive for the Dodgers - who make money from parking - to start a shuttle service. And there's no reason that taxpayers should have to subsidize the LA Dodgers. So I don't see anything happening until if and when they move to someplace more convenient to get to.
|
|
|
|
Post by LAofAnaheim on Apr 12, 2007 20:30:52 GMT -8
And there's no reason that taxpayers should have to subsidize the LA Dodgers. Who subsidizes the Hollywood Bowl & Rose Bowl shuttles? Why does Frank McCourt have that much authority to deny the city shuttles into its baseball stadium? Imagine, a bus only lane during game times would get people quick & efficient from Chinatown station to Dodger stadium. |
|
|
|
Post by masonite on Apr 12, 2007 20:52:52 GMT -8
Note that the Dodgers did sponsor a shuttle from Union Station on Friday night games for a year. I heard McCourt speak at Dodger Stadium for a special event, and he said they discontinued it because hardly anyone used it.
However, this may have been before the Gold Line was completed (I can't recall exactly). If there was ever a time to get it back in place, it would be now with their reputation soured with the parking mess and $15 parking charge.
I must say Dodger Stadium, which was once my favorite local sporting venue has become one of my least favorite with the hassle of getting in and out of there (I miss the organ music also). Staples Center, Coliseum, and Galen Center seem so much better integrated into the city and all will have rail transit very close once Expo Phase 1 opens (Staples already does now of course).
|
|
|
|
Post by Transit Coalition on Apr 12, 2007 21:55:33 GMT -8
One of the staff members of a County Supervisor contacted me about this and here is what he wrote:
Bart:
MTA reported to us that the Supervisor's motion (March 2006) to have MTA work with the Dodgers to create shuttle service for home games from our rail lines was met with resistance by the Dodgers and was unsuccessful for this season. Imagine how much traffic would be taken off of the 5, 110 and 101 for Dodger games, particularly on evenings during the work week.
We were hoping to invite the business community to sponsor the shuttle, defraying the majority of the cost, in a first real public/private partnership on public transit. Problem seems to be that the Dodgers lose parking money with every car trip that ends up taking a bus. If MTA chartered the service through LADOT (they can't directly per federal regulations), they could charge more than the base fare to cover the cost.
Let me know if you'd like more information on this.
Michael
and I wrote him back:
Mike:
The Dodgers are a private business. They are against public transportation. They could provide it, but the Dodgers are in the parking lot business. LADOT and Metro are not the low cost providers. Transit Systems is the low cost provider, but who will provide them with a subsidy? The City, the County and Metro should not have anything to do with interferring with a profitable private business or subsidizing it with bus service. The Dodgers should be mandated to provide service under air quality laws to reduce vehicle miles traveled.
Bart!
Perhaps one of you scholars could figure out how to make the Dodger Stadium situation a Major Air Quality Issue and perhaps could figure out some statewide Legislation that could force Sports Teams of a certain size to provide for Public Transportation under some sort of Air Quality guise.
The Transit Coalition is an activist type of outfit. While I wouldn't go to a Dodger game, because of their hate for Public Transit, I am sure one of you guys could step to the plate and call up Coalition for Clean Air or one of the AQ groups and become the project manager to get legislation introduced. McCourt needs to be beaned in the balls and the temple, as he is thick as a brick.
|
|
|
|
Post by kenalpern on Apr 13, 2007 5:06:20 GMT -8
After spending an hour extra getting to a Union Station meeting last night because of the Dodger game, I entirely agree. Speak to a City or State politician to champion this cause, or at least to use the bully pulpit.
|
|
|
|
Post by bluelineshawn on Apr 13, 2007 11:26:16 GMT -8
I notice more and more people using transit to get to Staples for BB and hockey games. I'd say that Kings fans are the biggest users. They're probably up to hundreds of people using the red/blue lines. Still it's probably only 500 people and that's with the Pico station being right next to Staples (okay 1 block away). That's only 2 or 3% of the total. It may eventually get to 10%, but what I'm getting at is I don't think that a shuttle to Dodger stadium is going to make a significant dent in the overall traffic. Especially considering the location at the top of the hill. Also people that go to baseball games (esp. in LA) like the convenience of being able to show up late and leave early whenever they're ready. You can do that when the stadium is on a rail line, but that would be hard with shuttle buses.
|
|
|
|
Post by whitmanlam on Apr 13, 2007 12:10:27 GMT -8
Even with a low percentage of transit use, it makes a big difference.
3% of 50,000 Dodger fans equals 1,500. That's about 600 cars off the streets. It does have an impact on an already choked 110 frwy.
The difference between Dodger Stadium and Staples, is that Staples parking is mostly independently owned. Some spaces will cost more than others depending on the location. But the people have a choice as to where they park and how far they're willing to walk. Prices are kept in check by rules of competition.
Dodger Stadium is a parking monopoly. It is remote and hard to get to by train, shuttle bus, or what not. The owners don't want to lose that revenue.
The only way is to force the issue. The City must force Dodger stadium to implement mass transit solutions. In return, some of the parking lots can be converted to Residential, commercial, or Industrial high rises.
This way, both sides gain something in return.
|
|
|
|
Post by Elson on Apr 13, 2007 19:17:31 GMT -8
And there's no reason that taxpayers should have to subsidize the LA Dodgers. Who subsidizes the Hollywood Bowl & Rose Bowl shuttles? The Hollywood Bowl is owned by Los Angeles County. The Rose Bowl is owned by the City of Pasadena. Both are publicly-owned entities, so public subsidies supporting transit to them are possible. |
|
|
|
Post by whitmanlam on Apr 13, 2007 22:40:59 GMT -8
And don't forget where Frank McCourt rose up from. He was a parking lot attendant.
|
|
|
|
Post by masonite on May 2, 2007 10:25:04 GMT -8
It is only a couple of thousand feet from the Chinatown station to Dodger Stadium as the crow flies (look on Google Maps). I've seen a recommendation for a tramway between the two. Ballpark figure would be $50M or so. Not a bad idea. I don't see the Dodgers getting behind it though as no revenue for them. It would be a nice benefit for Chinatown.
Maybe the city could allow some development in the Dodger parking lot in exchange for them building the tram. I could see that as a win-win. It is just such a shame that rail transit is so close to Dodger Stadium yet so far away due to the giant hill it is on and lack of direct walking access from Chinatown.
|
|
|
|
Post by Transit Coalition on May 2, 2007 11:49:53 GMT -8
Let's not fool anybody.
The Dodgers owner is greedy and disingenuous. He does not care about Air Quality, Traffic, Public Opinion, Public Transportation or does he give a hoot about what you think.
Look at these numbers: 16,000 parking spaces. A $5 per car increase. Up to $5,000 per game for more parking attendants. Take the $5 increase times 16M spaces = $80,000 less $5,000 in added attendant costs. Yield $75,000 more per game from you the fans on this one item.
Until there is an attitude change, McGreedy is going to maximize every on every way he can stiff you the sucker, er, the fan. Trams, buses, boat rides, magic carpets aren't in the pictures unless, McGreedy can get you to also pay him $15 to walk on his asphalt.
|
|
|
|
Post by jeffe77 on May 9, 2007 6:35:10 GMT -8
Just for kicks, I went to Cartifact and I placed the new Dodger stadium right next to a gold line extention. Check out this link.Your thoughts on the location and ease of public transit. |
|
|
|
Post by James Fujita on May 9, 2007 14:46:31 GMT -8
heh. well, that is a fun map to play with. if only it were that easy to move the stadium in real life. as it is, I'm worried that moving the stadium anywhere downtown will involve the city placing millions of dollars into Mr. McGreedy's pockets  however, this map does provide a valuable lesson. it is harder than it looks to find an empty lot or even a tear-down slum large enough to accomodate a Dodger Stadium. for example, if this map is correct, the "Cornfields" (Los Angeles Historic State Park) isn't large enough for a major league stadium— I was never fond of that idea, anyways.... |
|
|
|
Post by roadtrainer on May 9, 2007 17:06:42 GMT -8
The Road Trainer like your idea----But I put Dodger Stadium opposite of the Staples center. It can be easliy accessed by the Metro blue Line, The Metro Expo-Line, Metro Bus LIne 30,31, and The Rapid Buses That run Braodway, and the S.F. Valley buses too! (Heeyyy!!) Easy Aceess for the 484,485, and the imfamous 490 lines!!!
Now if the map would let me move Anahiem Angels Stadium out into the Pacific Ocean and leave it there I would have joyfully done it. The name "Los Angeles Angeles of Anaheim"leaves a bad taste in my mouth, the same awful tatse I get when I hear how the BRU claims to represent all bus riders of L.A. County!!!!!
|
|
|
|
Post by bluelineshawn on May 9, 2007 18:16:07 GMT -8
There's no space to build a stadium opposite the Staples Center. There are new developments due to break ground on those parking lots in the next few months. One of them in just a few weeks.
|
|
|
|
Post by whitmanlam on May 9, 2007 18:31:13 GMT -8
There is no place for a new stadium in the City of LA. The acreage involved is just too immense, and it has to connect to major freeways.
To find an new site you would have to look elsewhere, like Lancaster / Palmdale, The Pomona Fairplex, or Irwindale near the Santa Fe Dam.
It would favor something close to freeways and public transportation, like the Goldline Foothill extension, or Metrolink.
But then it can't truly be called L.A. can it ?
|
|
|
|
Post by tonyw79sfv on May 10, 2007 1:35:47 GMT -8
The New York Giants play in Rutherford, New Jersey and I don't hear the same uproar as the LA Angels debacle.
|
|
|
|
Post by bluelineshawn on May 10, 2007 10:05:58 GMT -8
As long as it's in LA County it's still LA. And there are lots of places for a stadium in the City of LA and also areas immediately adjacent to LA. Down by the harbor, a few areas in the South Bay, some in south LA, probably some in the Valley although I'm not very familiar with the Valley.
There's even that huge parking lot and vacant land next to the Crystal Park Casino. It's next to the blue line Artesia Station and accessible by the 91, 710, and 110 freeways. They're building something on part of it, but it's still huge.
|
|
|
|
Post by Elson on May 12, 2007 1:55:21 GMT -8
There is no place for a new stadium in the City of LA. The acreage involved is just too immense, and it has to connect to major freeways. To find an new site you would have to look elsewhere, like Lancaster / Palmdale, The Pomona Fairplex, or Irwindale near the Santa Fe Dam. It would favor something close to freeways and public transportation, like the Goldline Foothill extension, or Metrolink. But then it can't truly be called L.A. can it ? If/when Union Pacific Railroad decides to move all or part of their intermodal transfer facility along Mission Rd, just east of the L.A. river...that's a huuuuuge plot of land right there. |
|
|
|
Post by roadtrainer on May 15, 2007 20:59:24 GMT -8
There is no place for a new stadium in the City of LA. The acreage involved is just too immense, and it has to connect to major freeways. ;DWhatever I still think the best place for a "new Dodger Stadium" is opposite of Staples Center! As long as it is close to the Pico Chick Hearn Station!! Sincerely The Road Trainer  |
|
|
|
Post by Elson on May 21, 2007 18:12:16 GMT -8
There is no place for a new stadium in the City of LA. The acreage involved is just too immense, and it has to connect to major freeways. During the FOX-ownership era, there was a proposal to build a new stadium on the site of the Sports Arena (to be demolished) in Exposition Park, right next to the Coliseum. |
|
|
|
Post by masonite on May 25, 2007 15:21:25 GMT -8
Several years ago, there was a solid plan for a football stadium near Staples, so it is possible to fit in a stadium in a fairly dense urban area with some tinkering and a couple of road closures. I'd still like to see a stadium somewhere near there (or somewhere else in the downtown vicinity which would receive a positive pedestrian effect), although it would be more difficult now with all the loft development going on and so forth.
I still think the Chinatown gold line station could be better utilized for the current Dodger Stadium. I advocated a tram previously, but that may not be able to handle the crush of people right at game time. Another idea would be to create a direct pedestrian bridge between the parking lot and the station with escalators that could be turned on for game events. Again it is only a 2,000 feet or so between the two, so I am wondering how much something like that would cost (it probably wouldn't be cheap as it would have to go over a freeway and other roads). At least there would little operating cost for something like this. Ideally, the Dodgers and the MTA jointly fund.
Maybe pie in the sky, but if we had a green owner of the Dodgers who didn't only care about parking money, he might see the benefit to his image and the team by making the area more accessible. Also, this could be a tradeoff for some development in the parking lot of Dodger Stadium. I certainly could see the Chinatown community rally behind this as it would mean a lot more pedestrian traffic and business for them.
|
|
|
|
Post by whitmanlam on May 25, 2007 16:04:10 GMT -8
Generally, the trend has been every 30 years or so, a Sports franchise will demand the city to build a new stadium, with "modern" facilities. The city must then work with the owners to find a site and build it or else the team will relocate to another city.
Eventually Frank McCourt will become bored of Chavez Ravine and will want to demolish the old Stadium for a new one. Then a whole world of possibilities can open up.
Keep in mind, Downtown LA area is much bigger than just skyscrapers, there are some empty lots to the South and East of the civic center. Like Exposition Park, Industrial district, or the UP railyards.
|
|
