Progress???

[antonio]

When is this thing going to get built. I thought all the funding to Azusa was already put aside by the feds? They keep talking about a 2010 operation date but they better start building soon if they want to meet that. I think the Gold Line Authority just approved the FEIR but I'm not sure. I know a lot of people don't have this line in high priority but the corridor wants it and the Feds want to fund it so let's get it built ASAP.

[kenalpern]

...unless there's been a change of heart by the Feds...

Otherwise, Antonio, I entirely agree with you--these folks want this and deserve this at least to Azusa.

[erict]

I think that they are waiting on the R.O.D. from the feds and then funding (I guess) from the MTA before starting. Two counties are funding this if it is the full build. Any info on this would be great.

[whitmanlam]

I think they are still waiting on a Final EIR and analyses. Groundbreaking is scheduled for sometime in 2008 with completion in 2011. Pending the funds.

www.foothillextension.org

I saw the latest Metro Goldline ridership survey only 17,500 average weekday boardings for the month of February, this does not look good for Foothill extension boosters.

[Elson]

whitmanlam said:

I think they are still waiting on a Final EIR and analyses. Groundbreaking is scheduled for sometime in 2008 with completion in 2011. Pending the funds.

www.foothillextension.org

I saw the latest Metro Goldline ridership survey only 17,500 average weekday boardings for the month of February, this does not look good for Foothill extension boosters.

Though the Red Line never hit six-digit ridership until it got extended all the way to North Hollywood...

[erict]

..and don't forget the Eastside extension which will move the Gold line ridership numbers well ahead of the Green line in my opinion.

[antonio]

Once the eastside extension opens the Green Line will again be the stepchild of LA public transit (but 40,000 riders a day for a line that runs in the middle of a noisy freeway and goes from nowhere in particular to an area near the beach which is also nowhere in particular and bypasses one of the busiest airports in the world is a stellar number in my opinion)

[erict]

It is amazing. I think it may be because the line is so fast - the speed of the green line is much faster than the Blue or Gold - more like the Red line.

[antonio]

You're absolutely right. Anyone within two miles north or south of the Green Line will take it because it is significantly faster, even with bus connections, than crossing the county on a bus line. In addition a huge bulk of ridership is connection to the Blue Line.

[wad]

That Green Line speed does come at a price, though. Look at all the important destinations the Green Line misses. And I don't mean the airport, which would produce less ridership than if there were stations at:
*Westen Avenue. Los Angeles Southwest College is next door. Having a station next to a community college would increase boardings by about 5,000-10,000 boardings. Plus, it's the end of the line for both Line 207 and Gardena Line 2. Right now, the full route of Line 757 completes the gap by laying over at the Crenshaw station.
*Atlantic Boulevard. This is the most important north-south arterial east of Los Angeles. It also has a critical bus line (260/361), and will have a Rapid line in a few years. It is cut off from the Green Line and the El Monte Busway, both critical transfer points.
*Paramount. The Century Freeway runs through the city, yet there's no Green Line access for the community. Paramount riders must make a long bus ride to Downey or Lynwood to connect with the train.

[antonio]

Can someone gives us a rough price estimate on infill stations at those locations. I've noticed those gaps too and it would still be a speedy line with stations at Western and Atlantic (which are both important as you note)

[kenalpern]

There will be an increased focus on the Green Line as the Expo Line comes to a close with respect to funding, because should the next major project be a Crenshaw Blvd./Harbor Subdivision LRT then we'll see another reason for a Green Line/LAX connection, which is to enhance the connectivity of South L.A. and Southeastern L.A. County to the rest of the MetroRail Network.

Imagine a two-part LAX linkage, one from the south with the Green Line, and one from the north with the Crenshaw LRT project.

I have no idea where the funding and the political will would come from for a renewed focus on the rest of the Green Line, but I imagine that if the case could be made for one or two new stations then the idea will come about. Unfortunately, disruption to traffic flow on the 105 freeway would make this an expensive project and one that will likely be one that will be placed on the back burner compared to the two LAX-related New Starts projects I've described above.

[bahg]

the crazy part about the gold line is that at the lake station head east there is only two more stops but that is when all the traffic starts on the 210 and it is just as bad as the 405

[wad]

bahg said:

the crazy part about the gold line is that at the lake station head east there is only two more stops but that is when all the traffic starts on the 210 and it is just as bad as the 405

Only about a half mile east of there is the Hastings Ranch shopping center. It's not an easy walk from Sierra Madre Villa but only 3 minutes by bus.

[wad]

elson said:

Though the Red Line never hit six-digit ridership until it got extended all the way to North Hollywood...

Umm, the Gold Line was supposed to have its legs within two years. And this was the line that actually did things right and has favorable ridership factors. Only the Harbor Transitway has stagnated this badly.

Hell, we ought to tell northeast L.A. and Pasadena to get up to 30,000 boardings by the end of the year or dismantle the line north of Union Station.

[LAofAnaheim]

wad said:

elson said:

Hell, we ought to tell northeast L.A. and Pasadena to get up to 30,000 boardings by the end of the year or dismantle the line north of Union Station.

The ridership on this line will significantly jump once the Eastside extension is completed. Some areas on the eastside will patronize going to Pasadena via Gold Line (not just transferring to the Red Line). Especially residents in the Little Tokyo/Arts District, they will most likely use the Gold Line to the Rose Bowl, Old Town, etc... And in reverse, people can use the Little Tokyo stop to access the Civic Center, with a little walk. Eventhough the DT Connector would be the most beneficial, I think this extension will make the Gold line look good (not golden, until the DT Connector). And when that happens, everybody will see the pathetic ridership of the Orange Line.

[bobdavis]

Once the East LA extension is done and the Expo Line is well under way, the Foothill Extension construction can begin. When finished, this will serve people in the San Gabriel Valley who want to visit Pasadena without fighting the 210. It will serve students at both PCC and Citrus College. It's very likely that the existing Santa Anita mall, and its possible future competitor will provide shuttles to the Arcadia Gold Line station. All these elements should help the Gold Line "achieve its potential".

[kenalpern]

To some degree, I agree with you, Bob, but I wish that the San Gabriel Valley was screaming about the Downtown Connector as much as Mid-City and Westside transit advocates were. The biggest obstacle that the Foothill Extension is the pathetic ridership of the Pasadena Line, the main reason of which is its lack of connectivity.

Politically, the Pasadena Gold Line is still tarnished, and as much as some of us are using the example of the Pasadena Gold Line to scream about the Downtown Connector to avoid tarnishing the image of the future Expo Line, I still don't see the SGV Metro Boardmembers and Gold Line Authority leaders screaming and hollering to complete the Downtown Connector and make Pasadena Gold Line ridership go up enough to make it more politically viable to start the Foothill Gold Line extension.

I would never charge you and other prominent SGV transit advocates of being "allergic" to Downtown and Westside spending, but most Gold Line Authority and SGV leaders have unfortunately pursued a narcisisstic approach to building its Gold Line. So long as we had a GOP-led Congress (and I remind you, I am a Republican) that would bend and fracture the rules to fund the Gold Line without a balanced effort to fund other lines, that policy could be continued.

Things have changed, though, and Pasadena Gold Line ridership will remain so low that the only perceived regional benefit of a Pasadena Gold Line extension will be to create a maintenance yard at Irwindale. Any extension beyond that seems to remain on "Planet Never" until SGV political leaders finish the Pasadena segment of its Gold Line first, which means the creation of an underground Downtown Connector to really connect Pasadena to Downtown.

That said, I entirely support the Gold Line Foothill Extension, but recognize that a combined series of projects to complete a regional light rail system (a full Expo Line, a full Gold Line, a Downtown Connector to connect them, and a Green Line extension to LAX) must be SIMULTANEOUSLY funded and built or there will be continued acrimony where none need exist.

[bobdavis]

Yes, the Downtown Connector is a key element in having a real system and not just a collection of almost-standalone rail lines. The awkwardness of having to change trains three times to get from Pasadena to LAX makes selling rail transit to non-railfans a lot harder.

[whitmanlam]

Did anybody notice the long delay on the Gold Line today ? Was it because of the fire in Griffith Park ?
It took me 20 minutes to get from Union Station to Lincoln Heights station. They stopped the train for like 10 minutes on the bridge.

What was up with the delays ?

[erict]

Oh that is a brilliant idea, why stop there - dismantle the entire rail network that took so long to make and put 2000+ more buses on the roads. That should make commuting very nice for all.

[Tony Fernandez]

whitmanlam said:

Did anybody notice the long delay on the Gold Line today ? Was it because of the fire in Griffith Park ?
It took me 20 minutes to get from Union Station to Lincoln Heights station. They stopped the train for like 10 minutes on the bridge.

What was up with the delays ?

I've also had that problem, and there always seems to be some kind of delay while I'm on the line. However, I usually go on holidays, so I have to expect since holidays are when Metro decides to do maintenance.

[bobdavis]

If it's the bridge over the LA River, near the Gold Line yard, that's where they replace operators at shift changes. If there's a mixup, or an operator is delayed in getting to the platform, this could account for a longer than normal stop there.

[Mac]

well i saw a signal box right in the middle of the freeway, they haved started to clear away some stuff, if u can call that progress

[bobdavis]

There's a group of railfans on the "Trainorders.com" website who haven't forgiven Metro for pulling up a perfectly good railroad and building a trolley line in its place. They maintain that a Metrolink diesel powered service could have been built in less than two years by just adding platforms and upgrading the track rather than the long, drawn-out process that really happened. One person of this persuasion even did a PhotoShop creation that shows a Metrolink train crossing Mission St. in South Pasadena, adding the train and subtracting the trolley wire. Of course, electric railway fans like me like the way things worked out in the real world, although they shouldn't have taken so long. Where's Henry Huntington when you need him?

[antonio]

So is the Foothill extension still languishing with a completed EIR and no funding?

[kenalpern]

It's on the verge of funding...$320 million from the feds, with an agreed-to commitment of $80 million of local matching funding, to allow it to be extended to Azusa/Irwindale. The politics is going strong for a combined Expo/Downtown Connector/Foothill Gold Line effort.

[zoostation]

This is great news, particularly about bundling the project with the Downtown Connector.

[antonio]

That's very good to hear

edit: spelling

[Mac]

Wow, thats like a dream come true. I think I would then have to change my siggy if we get funded.