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Post by TransportationZ on May 20, 2016 6:01:54 GMT -8
They say that the investigation is ongoing. Train operators can make mistakes too. For example I've seen blue line trains run red lights on Washington several times. Do you know for sure that something similar didn't happen in this instance? According to this article in the Santa Monica Daily Press the driver was arrested for possession of cocaine: Second crash on Expo line - Santa Monica Daily PressGotta love the line being branded as potentially unsafe, as if the train is dangerous to the public when these cars are making illegal turns. Accidents happen in pretty much every city new to rail. With light rail expanding in the US, it should be required for drivers to be tested about driving around light rail. There is flashing train symbols in addition to signs and signals. It's time hold the driving public accountable for being careless and not paying attention.
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Post by thanks4goingmetro on May 20, 2016 12:36:16 GMT -8
Now that Expo Phase 2 is open, thoughts on the new map of the roughly 105 miles of Metro Rail? They thoughtfully included the 3 under-construction lines to sway you for the November ballot measure. For your consideration...
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Post by bzcat on May 20, 2016 13:51:49 GMT -8
Metro finally fixed the map in Downtown LA
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Post by Gokhan on May 20, 2016 21:53:37 GMT -8
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Post by John Ryan on May 21, 2016 9:51:47 GMT -8
Gokhan, thank you for your tireless advocacy and all your updates along the way--enjoy the ride! And now let's get Measure R2 passed!
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Post by Gokhan on May 21, 2016 13:43:12 GMT -8
Thank you, John! I spent a lot of time and effort especially during the DEIR phase of Phase 2 and some of the key design choices such as the locations of the Palms and Westwood Stations were made according to my recommendations. I think my Phase 2 Wikipedia page with the rendering of the Northvale Road Trench and listing of the advantages of the right-of-way alternative helped a lot, too.
Yes, hopefully Measure R2 will pass!
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Post by gatewaygent on May 22, 2016 9:31:20 GMT -8
While it's great that the opening of this line has come to pass, why is it that so many people are acting as though this were the only line that goes to the beach? Of our modern LRT lines, the Blue Line did it first! It didn't do it best, but still, it reached the beach first. Acknowledging that the Expo Line is the second outlet to the beach--a great achievement in and of itself--does not diminish it. In fact, being second opens the door to a third outlet. So let's keep our fingers crossed for outstanding daily ridership on the Expo Line to Downtown Santa Monica and hope that the increased tourism will make the likes of Manhattan Beach/Redondo Beach jealous enough to want to get in on the action and make a third beach line possible.
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Post by darrell on May 22, 2016 12:31:06 GMT -8
Here are two in Culver City yesterday: I really like the new cars, and this one on the Venice Blvd. bridge looks great with the downtown L.A. skyline in the distance.
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Post by Gokhan on May 22, 2016 13:12:57 GMT -8
While it's great that the opening of this line has come to pass, why is it that so many people are acting as though this were the only line that goes to the beach? Of our modern LRT lines, the Blue Line did it first! It didn't do it best, but still, it reached the beach first. Acknowledging that the Expo Line is the second outlet to the beach--a great achievement in and of itself--does not diminish it. In fact, being second opens the door to a third outlet. So let's keep our fingers crossed for outstanding daily ridership on the Expo Line to Downtown Santa Monica and hope that the increased tourism will make the likes of Manhattan Beach/Redondo Beach jealous enough to want to get in on the action and make a third beach line possible. Long Beach Blue Line is certainly a very important line. However, I tend to think Long Beach as more of an harbor than a leisure beach. I know there is a beach there but I doubt it's that popular. On a summer day, you can't find a spot to lay your towel by the Santa Monica Pier. The world-famous Venice Beach is also an easy and fun walk from there. Santa Monica almost saw the same fate as Long Beach in the early 20th Century but they decided to tear down the Long Wharf along withe the railroad tracks that lead to it, which was 2.3 miles north of Santa Monica Pier by the Lifeguard Headquarters there now. So, the Santa Monica Harbor idea was scrapped. I think when people think about the beach in LA, they usually think about Santa Monica and Venice. South Bay and Orange County beaches seem to be popular mostly by the locals.
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Post by Gokhan on May 22, 2016 13:24:02 GMT -8
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Post by Gokhan on May 22, 2016 13:29:07 GMT -8
After 16 years being active, with some members being active for 26+ years, a toast to Expo by Friends 4 Expo in a Cheviot Hills home. Note the color of the cups.
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Post by gatewaygent on May 22, 2016 22:41:12 GMT -8
Thank you Gokken. I wasn't trying to steal the Expo Line's thunder--it is indeed a good thing and something long missing on the Los Angeles County landscape. What I'm sensitive to is that there's more to L.A. than just the Westside. By all means let's celebrate the fact that we now have an outlet to west-facing beaches. However, let's also not forget that we've had an outlet to our south-facing beaches since the late 80's. Yes, the beach in Long Beach is green and yes, Long Beach is a part of the Gateway Cities, and yes, we're forgettable. But darn it, WE'RE HERE!!!
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Adrian Auer-Hudson
Junior Member
Supporter of "Expo Light Rail - Enabler for the Digital Coast".
Posts: 65
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Post by Adrian Auer-Hudson on May 23, 2016 0:36:47 GMT -8
Guys, I am jealous. This was such a happy day for you all, and I wasn't there. As soon as I am in town a ride to Santa Monica will be in order.
Work has taken me to England. It is as well that I am here. The day Expo opened, my father died. So, the Weekend brought very mixed emotions.
Thank you Guys, for staying the course and seeing this thru. Expo is a great asset for the fair county of Los Angeles.
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Post by Gokhan on May 23, 2016 13:54:08 GMT -8
What I'm sensitive to is that there's more to L.A. than just the Westside. By all means let's celebrate the fact that we now have an outlet to west-facing beaches. However, let's also not forget that we've had an outlet to our south-facing beaches since the late 80's. Yes, the beach in Long Beach is green and yes, Long Beach is a part of the Gateway Cities, and yes, we're forgettable. But darn it, WE'RE HERE!!! Very true!
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Post by bluelineshawn on May 23, 2016 19:48:05 GMT -8
Guys, I am jealous. This was such a happy day for you all, and I wasn't there. As soon as I am in town a ride to Santa Monica will be in order. Work has taken me to England. It is as well that I am here. The day Expo opened, my father died. So, the Weekend brought very mixed emotions. Thank you Guys, for staying the course and seeing this thru. Expo is a great asset for the fair county of Los Angeles. Thanks for your support from abroad. When you get to ride it, I think you'll like it. It "feels" slow now but maybe they get that worked out sooner rather than later.
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Post by simonla on May 23, 2016 22:13:02 GMT -8
Guys, I am jealous. This was such a happy day for you all, and I wasn't there. As soon as I am in town a ride to Santa Monica will be in order. Work has taken me to England. It is as well that I am here. The day Expo opened, my father died. So, the Weekend brought very mixed emotions. Thank you Guys, for staying the course and seeing this thru. Expo is a great asset for the fair county of Los Angeles. Thanks for your support from abroad. When you get to ride it, I think you'll like it. It "feels" slow now but maybe they get that worked out sooner rather than later. That's subjective and also dependent on which train you were on and if there were bunched up trains in front of you. I thought it was very speedy, including in the Santa Monica street-running portion.
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Post by TransportationZ on May 24, 2016 10:39:27 GMT -8
Thanks for your support from abroad. When you get to ride it, I think you'll like it. It "feels" slow now but maybe they get that worked out sooner rather than later. That's subjective and also dependent on which train you were on and if there were bunched up trains in front of you. I thought it was very speedy, including in the Santa Monica street-running portion. True. Bunching trains were a huge problem on opening day, and it resulted in many complaints of it being slow. When the trains aren't bunched you have significantly less random stopping a much faster and smoother trip. Thanks to the MOU, SM has its signals on Colorado in-line.
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Post by bluelineshawn on May 24, 2016 19:37:34 GMT -8
Thanks for your support from abroad. When you get to ride it, I think you'll like it. It "feels" slow now but maybe they get that worked out sooner rather than later. That's subjective and also dependent on which train you were on and if there were bunched up trains in front of you. I thought it was very speedy, including in the Santa Monica street-running portion. True. It is subjective and my intention by stating that it "feels slow" was to convey that subjectivity. Still I'm discounting the extended stops and referring mainly to the overall slow speed. The other light rail lines in LA reach 55 mph (blue line) or greater (gold and green) for extended periods. I don't think expo reaches that speed or anywhere close to it. Then there's the traffic lights. They were actually better on my rides than on most of my previous expo trips. Still I enjoyed my trip and I'll be a routine rider although not a regular since it doesn't go where I work.
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Post by Gokhan on May 24, 2016 22:43:12 GMT -8
That's subjective and also dependent on which train you were on and if there were bunched up trains in front of you. I thought it was very speedy, including in the Santa Monica street-running portion. True. It is subjective and my intention by stating that it "feels slow" was to convey that subjectivity. Still I'm discounting the extended stops and referring mainly to the overall slow speed. The other light rail lines in LA reach 55 mph (blue line) or greater (gold and green) for extended periods. I don't think expo reaches that speed or anywhere close to it. Then there's the traffic lights. They were actually better on my rides than on most of my previous expo trips. Still I enjoyed my trip and I'll be a routine rider although not a regular since it doesn't go where I work. Expo has several 55 MPH sections, including most sections in Phase 1 west of Exposition/Rodeo (except around Farmdale and in Culver City), between Culver City and Palms, and between Westwood and 26th (except around the Stewart Street Yard). The only slow sections I noticed in Phase 2 are the Colorado Ave (25 MPH and several red lights), double-crossover diamond at 19th St (5 MPH?), yard bypass (usually a full stop and wait), and some station approaches (10 MPH). I think they could have shaved off a few minutes if they were a little more careful designing these.
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Post by bluelineshawn on May 25, 2016 18:09:07 GMT -8
True. It is subjective and my intention by stating that it "feels slow" was to convey that subjectivity. Still I'm discounting the extended stops and referring mainly to the overall slow speed. The other light rail lines in LA reach 55 mph (blue line) or greater (gold and green) for extended periods. I don't think expo reaches that speed or anywhere close to it. Then there's the traffic lights. They were actually better on my rides than on most of my previous expo trips. Still I enjoyed my trip and I'll be a routine rider although not a regular since it doesn't go where I work. Expo has several 55 MPH sections, including most sections in Phase 1 west of Exposition/Rodeo (except around Farmdale and in Culver City), between Culver City and Palms, and between Westwood and 26th (except around the Stewart Street Yard). The only slow sections I noticed in Phase 2 are the Colorado Ave (25 MPH and several red lights), double-crossover diamond at 19th St (5 MPH?), yard bypass (usually a full stop and wait), and some station approaches (10 MPH). I think they could have shaved off a few minutes if they were a little more careful designing these. Thank you for that correction. I think it will get faster. The gold line used to be slower than it is now and no longer feels slow to me.
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Post by thanks4goingmetro on May 26, 2016 10:40:06 GMT -8
The only slow sections I noticed in Phase 2 are the Colorado Ave (25 MPH and several red lights), double-crossover diamond at 19th St (5 MPH?), yard bypass (usually a full stop and wait), and some station approaches (10 MPH). I think they could have shaved off a few minutes if they were a little more careful designing these. I too am optimistic that it will improve. When I ride it seems like a different experience every time, here's my evaluation on 4 roundtrips since opening: First day westbound: stopped at no red lights on Flower Street and Exposition, Phase 2 part was slow First day eastbound: on a P3010 jerky the whole way back and pretty slow too (buggy train and maybe a new operator), but it made all the lights on Colorado and Exposition but hit all reds on Flower. Second day: The whole route was slow going hit about half of the red lights and stopped in the Steward yard for a driver change Second day eastbound: stop and go the whole way with lots of hard braking, randomly made a full stop at operational crossing gates, maybe it was a new operator or the P3010 is very buggy Sunday westbound Got on at Western, First time I've seen it take the Olympic bridge at 55mph, Phase 1 was very fast, creeped along Colorado Sunday eastbound: Phase 2 was rather slow operator creeped through the Stewart yard and slowed before every single switch and stopped short of nearly every station to proceed at 5mph Wednesday: Stopped at every red light on Flower, Exposition, and Colorado, and creeped through the Steward yard Wednesday eastbound: Sailed down Colorado, Exposition, and Flower (hit only one red light at Jefferson), was the first time I saw it go past the Stewart yard at 55mph, I think it may have actually made it in 46-47 mins
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Post by davebowman on May 26, 2016 10:48:34 GMT -8
So far the first three times I've taken an evening rush hour (5:15-5:45pm) train WB the train has stopped in the Stewart Street yard for an operator change, although it's only been for a minute or so. How often do they change operators?
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Post by TransportationZ on May 26, 2016 12:03:59 GMT -8
It seems to be a combination of operator skill, bugs with the new LRVs and luck with the signals. One trip you may hit one or two lights the whole trip, then on the return trip crawl as slow as a bus.
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Post by darrell on May 26, 2016 12:27:42 GMT -8
More photos from opening weekend ... The special train about to board at 7th/Metro downtown, Friday, May 20 The tent set up at 4th Street station Mayor Garcetti speaking, with Metro board members Bonin, Fasana, and Ridley-Thomas on the left Colorado & 4th terminus after public rides began Construction nearing completion on promenade to the Pier Passing the maintenance yard Saturday riders at 4th Street Train heading west toward Palms station
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Post by darrell on May 26, 2016 22:50:30 GMT -8
Here's another photo I enjoy of a P3010 test train leaving the terminus station on May 13.
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Post by gatewaygent on May 30, 2016 22:28:24 GMT -8
Yay! I finally got to ride! The trip from 7th/Metro to DTSM felt like it took forever! A woman in one of the cars kept calling the conductor to complain that the a/c wasn't working. The a/c was on though. The conductor asked her to switch cars if she felt uncomfortable. Anyway after spending a nice day on the pier and walking the Third Street Promenade, I returned home. There was fresh graffiti where I was sitting. It upset me when I saw it, so I stood up instead. This trip felt a lot speedier. In fact, I timed it: 48 minutes end to end. As a bonus, when I got to LAUS to catch the Gold Line back to Atlantic Station where I was parked, I got to ride car 1015. The interior smelled and looked brand spankin' new, so that was nice ending.
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Post by darrell on Jun 1, 2016 21:18:47 GMT -8
Photos today - it was a bit cloudy, but still got some good ones. 1. From the Cheviot pedestrian bridge, a variety of equipment while I waited for a P 3010 train Note how low the pantographs are going under the pedestrian bridge. A cat chasing a butterfly! 2. From the roof parking at BB&B Finally, a good view of the P 3010's roof! I have more, if anyone would like them.
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Post by masonite on Jun 3, 2016 14:33:57 GMT -8
Expo has several 55 MPH sections, including most sections in Phase 1 west of Exposition/Rodeo (except around Farmdale and in Culver City), between Culver City and Palms, and between Westwood and 26th (except around the Stewart Street Yard). The only slow sections I noticed in Phase 2 are the Colorado Ave (25 MPH and several red lights), double-crossover diamond at 19th St (5 MPH?), yard bypass (usually a full stop and wait), and some station approaches (10 MPH). I think they could have shaved off a few minutes if they were a little more careful designing these. Thank you for that correction. I think it will get faster. The gold line used to be slower than it is now and no longer feels slow to me. I am not so sure. I thought Metro learned their lesson when the Gold Line opened to Pasadena and initially ridership was very low and people complained about the speed. They tried express trains and then were able to speed up the line after ending the Express train experiment. However, there hasn't been any such progress on the Eastside Gold Line when the same thing happened (it opened to low ridership and people complained about the speed). Then they agreed to put in the Farmdale stop on Expo just to avoid building a pedestrian bridge. That is 2 minutes right there and that decision says a lot about how they feel about the importance of the speed of the lines. Of course, the signals are up to LA, not Metro, but to some extent they are similar entities. Mayor of LA serves on Metro Board too. I don't think the Blue Line has sped up in the 26 years it has been open - correct me if I am wrong.
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Post by Gokhan on Jun 3, 2016 15:44:56 GMT -8
Thank you for that correction. I think it will get faster. The gold line used to be slower than it is now and no longer feels slow to me. I am not so sure. I thought Metro learned their lesson when the Gold Line opened to Pasadena and initially ridership was very low and people complained about the speed. They tried express trains and then were able to speed up the line after ending the Express train experiment. However, there hasn't been any such progress on the Eastside Gold Line when the same thing happened (it opened to low ridership and people complained about the speed). Then they agreed to put in the Farmdale stop on Expo just to avoid building a pedestrian bridge. That is 2 minutes right there and that decision says a lot about how they feel about the importance of the speed of the lines. Of course, the signals are up to LA, not Metro, but to some extent they are similar entities. Mayor of LA serves on Metro Board too. I don't think the Blue Line has sped up in the 26 years it has been open - correct me if I am wrong. Actually, Expo Line has got slower. Culver City was 28 minutes (accounting for one minute for stop-and-proceed when it was the interim terminus), and now, it's 30 minutes. So, it has got 2 minutes slower.
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Post by darrell on Jun 3, 2016 23:35:02 GMT -8
I am not so sure. I thought Metro learned their lesson when the Gold Line opened to Pasadena and initially ridership was very low and people complained about the speed. They tried express trains and then were able to speed up the line after ending the Express train experiment. However, there hasn't been any such progress on the Eastside Gold Line when the same thing happened (it opened to low ridership and people complained about the speed). Then they agreed to put in the Farmdale stop on Expo just to avoid building a pedestrian bridge. That is 2 minutes right there and that decision says a lot about how they feel about the importance of the speed of the lines. Of course, the signals are up to LA, not Metro, but to some extent they are similar entities. Mayor of LA serves on Metro Board too. I don't think the Blue Line has sped up in the 26 years it has been open - correct me if I am wrong. Actually, Expo Line has got slower. Culver City was 28 minutes (accounting for one minute for stop-and-proceed when it was the interim terminus), and now, it's 30 minutes. So, it has got 2 minutes slower. The Blue Line cut five minutes along Washington Blvd. with signal synchronization some years ago. I don't know where the slowing was on the Pasadena Gold Line originally (something about inadequate substations for power?), but it's fast now, a reliable 20 minutes from Union Station to Del Mar (my station).
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