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Post by LAofAnaheim on Jun 30, 2014 11:39:40 GMT -8
Huh? I thought we debunked the whole "lack of trains will delay Expo's opening" rumblings weeks ago. I am now doubting that Metro will open the line before they can run 6-minute headways. Phase 2 ridership will be very high and I don't think they would risk a bad initial impression with very overcrowded trains. If the Metro Blue Line can operate between 80K - 100K with 6 - 12 minute headways (usually 10 min headways), there is no reason the Expo Line cannot do the same. There is still plenty of space to stand and sit in the Blue Line, it's not like a crowded London or Paris train where you are literally being pushed out the door.
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Post by tramfan on Jun 30, 2014 12:43:44 GMT -8
If Skanska delivers all major construction by the end of 2014 as they have announced (and they're really working diligently to do just that), does it really take more than a year to build and test all the electrical, train control and pre revenue operation? The politically correct company line of MTA has always been 2016 so why feed all kind of optimistic predictions and then be left with egg on your face if it does not come true? An earlier opening would be an unprecedented publicity coup for MTA and all the politicians who championed this LTR expansion but do not expect them to get everybody's hope up and then when it fails having to deal with the disappointment and political repercussions.
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Post by Gokhan on Jun 30, 2014 13:44:13 GMT -8
I am now doubting that Metro will open the line before they can run 6-minute headways. Phase 2 ridership will be very high and I don't think they would risk a bad initial impression with very overcrowded trains. If the Metro Blue Line can operate between 80K - 100K with 6 - 12 minute headways (usually 10 min headways), there is no reason the Expo Line cannot do the same. There is still plenty of space to stand and sit in the Blue Line, it's not like a crowded London or Paris train where you are literally being pushed out the door. Peak-time headways on the Blue Line are 6 minutes, period -- not "6 - 12", not "usually 10", or not anything else. Also, whatever headway is on the Blue Line, Expo needs to be an integer multiple of. Expo Phase 2 will have 60k or more initial ridership. At 12-minute headways, that's equivalent to Blue Line with 120k ridership at 6-minute headways -- that's too crowded even for the Blue Line and far too crowded for a line that has just opened. The plans are to run both Blue and Expo Lines with 5-minute headways as soon as there are enough trains to do so.
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Post by JerardWright on Jun 30, 2014 15:58:27 GMT -8
If the Metro Blue Line can operate between 80K - 100K with 6 - 12 minute headways (usually 10 min headways), there is no reason the Expo Line cannot do the same. There is still plenty of space to stand and sit in the Blue Line, it's not like a crowded London or Paris train where you are literally being pushed out the door. Peak-time headways on the Blue Line are 6 minutes, period -- not "6 - 12", not "usually 10", or not anything else. Also, whatever headway is on the Blue Line, Expo needs to be an integer multiple of. Expo Phase 2 will have 60k or more initial ridership. At 12-minute headways, that's equivalent to Blue Line with 120k ridership at 6-minute headways -- that's too crowded even for the Blue Line and far too crowded for a line that has just opened. The plans are to run both Blue and Expo Lines with 5-minute headways as soon as there are enough trains to do so. Not really because you have to remember that the loading will be equally busy in both directions like the Red Line. With workers in Santa Monica and West LA. With the Blue Line as I'm a daily user of it, with the 3 car trains and 6 minute frequency only every other train is full and packed so if you include the strong demand in both directions they could operate with a 12 minute headway, provided they stick to strong on-time performance
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Post by RMoses on Jul 1, 2014 9:48:58 GMT -8
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Post by darrell on Jul 1, 2014 14:33:01 GMT -8
I saw a few OCS poles along the eastern part of the self-storage building in Palms today, and the poles east and west of Overland now have crossarms mounted.
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Post by darrell on Jul 2, 2014 0:25:22 GMT -8
I saw a few OCS poles along the eastern part of the self-storage building in Palms today, and the poles east and west of Overland now have crossarms mounted. Photos at the Overland crossing of OCS pole crossarms and the crossing gate mechanisms ...
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Post by tramfan on Jul 2, 2014 7:15:11 GMT -8
I sent about 15 photos to Expoline fan's Ipernity photo library of the Overland, Westwood and Military/Sepulveda construction sites. Still too much hassle posting them here...
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Post by tramfan on Jul 3, 2014 12:15:50 GMT -8
Elevator cages at the Sepulveda station! Posted photos at the Expo line fan Ipernity strand.
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Post by Alexis Kasperavičius on Jul 6, 2014 23:34:05 GMT -8
Dwight posted a couple hundred construction update pictures from several sources over the week-end. Here's the link for any newbies: www.ipernity.com/home/expo-line
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Post by TransportationZ on Jul 7, 2014 8:13:10 GMT -8
Expo, even with Phase 2, will probably barely crack 55,000 riders/day Completely Disagree. Considering the track record of ridership estimates to actual ridership, hitting 64,000 will be easy. With a Crenshaw Line and Regional Connector, this section could easily hit 70,000.
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f ron
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Post by f ron on Jul 7, 2014 9:06:54 GMT -8
Expo, even with Phase 2, will probably barely crack 55,000 riders/day Completely Disagree. Considering the track record of ridership estimates to actual ridership, hitting 64,000 will be easy. With a Crenshaw Line and Regional Connector, this section could easily hit 70,000. I respect you optimism even if I disagree with your estimations as I'm in the 45-55,000 range for the first year and even that feels like I'm reaching even as I type it. Would love to see a poll for this topic.
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Post by masonite on Jul 7, 2014 10:23:50 GMT -8
Completely Disagree. Considering the track record of ridership estimates to actual ridership, hitting 64,000 will be easy. With a Crenshaw Line and Regional Connector, this section could easily hit 70,000. I respect you optimism even if I disagree with your estimations as I'm in the 45-55,000 range for the first year and even that feels like I'm reaching even as I type it. Would love to see a poll for this topic. Depends on when you are talking. If it is one year after it opens and they have the ability to run 6 minute headways say 9 months after it opens, then I think 55k - 60k is not unrealistic at all. With Crenshaw and the Connector, it will soar to easily over 75k in my opinion if they can keep to the timetable of 45-46 minutes.
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Post by joshuanickel on Jul 7, 2014 11:12:21 GMT -8
Note the upcoming two week closure of 14th Street in Santa Monica:
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Post by joshuanickel on Jul 7, 2014 11:20:14 GMT -8
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Post by culvercitylocke on Jul 7, 2014 11:28:05 GMT -8
well that would be good, the asphalt at the various completed street crossings is piss poor, on the other hand, Lincoln is exceptionally perfect. Nice to see Santa Monica make them do it right.
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f ron
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Post by f ron on Jul 7, 2014 12:14:16 GMT -8
I respect you optimism even if I disagree with your estimations as I'm in the 45-55,000 range for the first year and even that feels like I'm reaching even as I type it. Would love to see a poll for this topic. Depends on when you are talking. If it is one year after it opens and they have the ability to run 6 minute headways say 9 months after it opens, then I think 55k - 60k is not unrealistic at all. With Crenshaw and the Connector, it will soar to easily over 75k in my opinion if they can keep to the timetable of 45-46 minutes. My frame of reference is the first 12-24 months of operation, with emphasis on the first 12. I would sincerely hope that ridership increases in 2018 when the Crenshaw is expected to open, likewise 2019 for the regional connector at which point numbers around and above 60 ring true to me.
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Post by masonite on Jul 7, 2014 14:55:58 GMT -8
Depends on when you are talking. If it is one year after it opens and they have the ability to run 6 minute headways say 9 months after it opens, then I think 55k - 60k is not unrealistic at all. With Crenshaw and the Connector, it will soar to easily over 75k in my opinion if they can keep to the timetable of 45-46 minutes. My frame of reference is the first 12-24 months of operation, with emphasis on the first 12. I would sincerely hope that ridership increases in 2018 when the Crenshaw is expected to open, likewise 2019 for the regional connector at which point numbers around and above 60 ring true to me. FYI, Crenshaw is not expected to be completed until at least Oct. 2019 and the Regional Connector is late 2020.
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f ron
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Post by f ron on Jul 7, 2014 15:08:35 GMT -8
My frame of reference is the first 12-24 months of operation, with emphasis on the first 12. I would sincerely hope that ridership increases in 2018 when the Crenshaw is expected to open, likewise 2019 for the regional connector at which point numbers around and above 60 ring true to me. FYI, Crenshaw is not expected to be completed until at least Oct. 2019 and the Regional Connector is late 2020. Thanks for the update on the openings. Good to know. I was referencing the Draft 2014 Short Range Transportation Plan from last April. I wasn't aware that the dates have since been revised. EDITED TO ADD: --and it appears I misread the Plan in the first place. So thanks again for calling my attention to it.
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Post by andert on Jul 7, 2014 16:24:20 GMT -8
My frame of reference is the first 12-24 months of operation, with emphasis on the first 12. I would sincerely hope that ridership increases in 2018 when the Crenshaw is expected to open, likewise 2019 for the regional connector at which point numbers around and above 60 ring true to me. FYI, Crenshaw is not expected to be completed until at least Oct. 2019 and the Regional Connector is late 2020. Interesting, I wonder if those are 'safe dates' so-to-speak, like the 'late 2016' expo 2 opening date. Was there a concrete reason we know of that the openings were pushed back?
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Post by masonite on Jul 7, 2014 16:32:34 GMT -8
FYI, Crenshaw is not expected to be completed until at least Oct. 2019 and the Regional Connector is late 2020. Interesting, I wonder if those are 'safe dates' so-to-speak, like the 'late 2016' expo 2 opening date. Was there a concrete reason we know of that the openings were pushed back? These are from the latest Construction Committee Meeting back in May. They show Expo opening in Jan. 2016. Crenshaw seems at least partially behind schedule from adding the additional stations and so forth. media.metro.net/board/Items/2014/05_may/20140515conitem40handout.pdf
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Post by darrell on Jul 7, 2014 23:12:44 GMT -8
From late this morning, on a kind-of-hazy day: Looking south from Colorado, 19th Street is closed for its grade crossing. Next week will be 20th Street; looking west (above) and east (below). Note that the old Air Line crossing pole is still there. This new view of the Bundy bridge (west over the parapet from the roof parking at Bed Bath and Beyond) is especially for Dwight! And east, toward the Pico bridge, Barrington in the foreground.
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Post by Gokhan on Jul 9, 2014 12:08:32 GMT -8
Opening date in the short-range plan or anywhere else has no meaning whatsoever at this late point. Disregard them all. Line is scheduled to be handed over to Metro in May 2015 and in theory it could open in June 2015. It's up to Metro when and how to open it, depending on the train availability and tuning process of the ATP.
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Post by Gokhan on Jul 9, 2014 12:11:27 GMT -8
Venice Blvd Bridge:
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Post by gatewaygent on Jul 9, 2014 18:20:11 GMT -8
I can't wait for the pic that shows the removal of the light pole in the middle of the tracks.
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Post by Gokhan on Jul 11, 2014 8:47:11 GMT -8
I didn't expect the joining of the Phase 1 and Phase 2 tracks at the east end of the Venice Boulevard Bridge to be done in this manner. They removed a portion of the Phase 1 rail on one side of the track and they extended the Phase 2 rail to match it. On the other side of the track, Phase 1 rail was unchanged. In other words, the two rails aren't joined at the same location but there is about a 10 ft spacing. You can also see an insulated rail joint nearby (to prevent the block signals from passing): Track 3 eastbound. The welded joint is at the shiny ground spot. Note the 10 ft spacing between the two joints: Track 4 westbound: Bumper and temporary OCS pole. AC-insulated joint is right before the bumper and you can see the DC jumper cables with an inductive AC filter for the traction current: Poles for the first green track fences are being installed and tracks are approaching the Venice Boulevard Ramp:
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f ron
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Post by f ron on Jul 11, 2014 11:00:13 GMT -8
Northvale Trench Update:
They've installed LED overhead lighting on top of all the catenary poles along the trench. This is a new and unexpected wrinkle --does anyone here have any experience with this type of lighting?
Is it super direct or will there be a degree of overspray and and unwanted ambient lighting during the night time hours? It's particularly concerning for those who live in close, elevated proximity along the south side as Metro couldn't be bothered to spring for any visors to better direct the light downwards.
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Post by masonite on Jul 11, 2014 11:44:41 GMT -8
Opening date in the short-range plan or anywhere else has no meaning whatsoever at this late point. Disregard them all. Line is scheduled to be handed over to Metro in May 2015 and in theory it could open in June 2015. It's up to Metro when and how to open it, depending on the train availability and tuning process of the ATP. Of course, that is with no contingency, which I agree is diminishing rapidly as they get closer to the finish. Of course, it is still all a guess. I think the real question is the speed of the line. Will it really be able to do it consistently on a 45 minute run. If people get on a 55 minute run they might not ride again. The first phase has lost out on many thousands of riders due to its slow speed. There are very few office workers in Downtown who take the line even if they live in Culver City. They found it is much faster for them to drive. Phase 2 should be fairly fast except for Downtown Santa Monica, so maybe we'll have a half a line at a pretty decent speed (basically La Brea to 17th Street/SMC Station). That will attract quite a few riders, because the Westside is so clogged.
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f ron
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Post by f ron on Jul 11, 2014 16:18:41 GMT -8
Northvale Trench Update: They've installed LED overhead lighting on top of all the catenary poles along the trench. This is a new and unexpected wrinkle --does anyone here have any experience with this type of lighting? Is it super direct or will there be a degree of overspray and and unwanted ambient lighting during the night time hours? It's particularly concerning for those who live in close, elevated proximity along the south side as Metro couldn't be bothered to spring for any visors to better direct the light downwards. Here's a look at the lights on the catenary poles I mentioned earlier:
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Post by jeisenbe on Jul 13, 2014 21:17:41 GMT -8
Northvale Trench Update: They've installed LED overhead lighting on top of all the catenary poles along the trench. This is a new and unexpected wrinkle --does anyone here have any experience with this type of lighting? Is it super direct or will there be a degree of overspray and and unwanted ambient lighting during the night time hours? It's particularly concerning for those who live in close, elevated proximity along the south side as Metro couldn't be bothered to spring for any visors to better direct the light downwards. Most LEDs are very directional, similar to halogen spot lights. As long as the right type of LEDs are picked, the light should remain around the tracks and the bottom of the trench, with very little light wasted to the sides. I don't think the neighbors have anything to be concerned about.
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