|
Post by Gokhan on Feb 25, 2011 13:53:31 GMT -8
I agree with the option to open as far as they can as soon as possible. Delaying it to wait for Robertson only make sense if you have a "westside" mindset. Expo will probably see significant ridership from Day 1 between Metro Center and USC. It would be great to see the train running for football games. I am for phased openings but they are delaying the La Cienega opening for too long. It could easily open in August. Perhaps Farmdale is the problem. If it will open as late as in November, it would be better if they sped up the Culver Junction Station so that the whole thing could open in January instead.
|
|
|
Post by James Fujita on Feb 25, 2011 14:22:20 GMT -8
They should open what they can when they can. For a lot of people, USC/ Exposition Park would be a pretty big deal. It's not always about the terminus. (I feel the same way about the Eastside Gold Line, or even the Red Line) Unlike the terminus of the Red, Gold and Green Lines, Venice/Robertson will be a huge destination station being only .8 miles from downtown and the key transit corridor to West LA and Santa Monica. I wouldn't put this station in comparison to Atlantic, Sierra Madre, Norwalk, Redondo Beach or North Hollywood. Man, I just realized we have some sucky terminuses. Termini. ;D The only remaining terminals left unnamed are both ends of the Blue Line, Union Station for the Red Line, and the Purple Line's Koreatown stations. USC- UCLA is at the Coliseum, Nov. 26, 2011.... can we get something up and running by then?
|
|
|
Post by antonio on Feb 25, 2011 16:02:58 GMT -8
I beg to differ about North Hollywood not being an important terminus. Pretty much all of the important transit service provided by Metro serving the 1.4 million people in the SFV is funneled into this station, the Orange Line being the most notable. In addition, the further development potential for the area is astounding. It would be a high performing ridership station even if it were not a terminus. There is already a lot more residential density around the station than there is around the Culver Junction (which only has density to the W/SW of the station north of Venice) and .8 miles is not exactly ideally situated (that's around a 15-17 minute walk to the station if you keep a brisk pace). The NoHo Arts District is no slouch of a destination even in comparison to downtown Culver City and within a much shorter walking distance.
|
|
|
Post by LAofAnaheim on Feb 25, 2011 16:11:31 GMT -8
True. I shouldn't have put North Hollywood in the same boat with Norwalk, Redondo Beach, Atlantic or Sierra Madre.
|
|
|
Post by James Fujita on Feb 25, 2011 21:29:28 GMT -8
well, okay. North Hollywood doesn't belong on the list of sucky terminals. Sorry, I haven't been there in a while.
But my original point was, we can't get hung up on the end points, especially in a case like this.
We all know that the ultimate goal is Santa Monica, not Culver City.
In the meantime, there's a lot to be said for intermediate stations as well. USC/ Exposition Park is going to be a major attraction, and Trojan football will be a good test of the new line.
|
|
|
Post by roadtrainer on Feb 25, 2011 21:49:14 GMT -8
From conversation at the Culver City meeting tonight: * Possible November opening to La Cienega (depending on testing and board approval). * Possible April opening to Venice/Robertson. * First test train perhaps late March (after a dummy to test clearances goes first), with advance notice for all of us who want to witness the milestone. And great to meet roadtrainer in person - thanks for introducing yourself! it was great to finally meet Darrell Clarke, But Gokham where were you? I wanted to meet you too!
|
|
|
Post by wad on Feb 26, 2011 5:24:23 GMT -8
Expo will probably see significant ridership from Day 1 between Metro Center and USC. And Line 81 and DASH Line F will be curiously empty.
|
|
|
Post by LAofAnaheim on Feb 26, 2011 9:50:13 GMT -8
And Line 81 and DASH Line F will be curiously empty. Line 81 serves its purpose south of Exposition boulevard as the local service, so it will be fine. I can see Dash F being eliminated once the Expo Line begins service. I think LADOT should move its resources from the F Dash into a new Dash that circulates between Union Station, Greyhound and the Fashion District. Start at Union Station go south on Alameda to 7th street, turn west on 7th and north on Los Angeles street and return to Union Station. There's a lot of people who are perplexed there is no direct Union Station to Greyhound bus or rail line.
|
|
|
Post by bobdavis on Feb 26, 2011 18:40:17 GMT -8
Please change Sierra Madre to Sierra Madre Villa; like I've said before, the City of Sierra Madre hasn't had rail service for over 60 years, and it's highly unlikely that Metro wants to run tracks up there. I'm still annoyed that they didn't call the station East Pasadena, which would be historically appropriate. Whatever you call it, it can't "suck" too much--try to find a parking spot there on a weekday! I'll be interested to see how busy it is after the extension to Azusa opens.
|
|
|
Post by James Fujita on Feb 26, 2011 19:43:46 GMT -8
Well, suck is a relative term. I personally like the architectural design of Redondo Beach/ Marine, but I must admit that it is a placeholder station. It looks like they needed an end point, and south of Redondo, "here lie NIMBYs". They may not have had the money or the desire to build further south in 1993, even as the need grows more and more obvious in 2011. I do agree that the name "Sierra Madre Villa" is not the best name possible for that station. I suspect that it is also a placeholder of sorts, and when the end of the line is Azusa, it's possible that the parking structure there will be less full. And other stations are better now than they were when they first opened. I was not at all impressed with North Hollywood when I first saw it, but I later realized that the station was slightly off from the redeveloping NoHo district. EDIT: Suckage also depends on whether you're coming or going. If you're headed TO Pasadena, Memorial Park is a much better choice. If you're leaving Long Beach, Willow is better; but if you get off at Willow, you'll find yourself in the middle of a boring shopping center far from the ocean. The Transit Mall excels at getting people TO Long Beach. Perhaps we need a poll. Which of these sucks the least/ sucks the most: * Long Beach Transit Mall * 7th/ Metro * Norwalk * Atlantic, East Los Angeles * Sierra Madre Villa, Pasadena * Wilshire/ Western * North Hollywood * Redondo Beach/ Marine * Union Station If the question is worded "which sucks the least," Union Station should be left off the list, as it would overwhelm the others in its brilliance. Of course, there would be a certain amount of hometown/ home rail line boosterism, as I myself am rather fond of Long Beach's downtown, and the Transit Mall station lets out at Pine Avenue, just north of the convention center.
|
|
|
Post by LAofAnaheim on Feb 27, 2011 0:07:30 GMT -8
Perhaps we need a poll. Which of these sucks the least/ sucks the most: * Long Beach Transit Mall * 7th/ Metro * Norwalk * Atlantic, East Los Angeles * Sierra Madre Villa, Pasadena * Wilshire/ Western * North Hollywood * Redondo Beach/ Marine * Union Station If the question is worded "which sucks the least," Union Station should be left off the list, as it would overwhelm the others in its brilliance. Of course, there would be a certain amount of hometown/ home rail line boosterism, as I myself am rather fond of Long Beach's downtown, and the Transit Mall station lets out at Pine Avenue, just north of the convention center. Honestly, I don't understand the purpose of this poll. Which sucks the least? In terms of asthetics, LA Union Station is the # 1 station by and far. But, in terms of destinations, I would not put Union Station, 7th street, Wilshire/Western, LB Transit Mall, or North Hollywood in the same sentence/league with Atlantic, Sierra Madre, Norwalk or Redondo Beach. I think the point earlier was that we have some crappy terminal stations. Union Station, 7th street, Wilshire/Western, LB Transit Mall, or North Hollywood do not fit that consideration. Those are important stations with destinations.
|
|
|
Post by wad on Feb 27, 2011 5:52:01 GMT -8
There's a lot of people who are perplexed there is no direct Union Station to Greyhound bus or rail line. Once upon a time, there was Metro Line 58. Only a couple hundred people rode it. It was canceled. I'd rather just get Greyhound to move its terminal into Union Station. At least this way, Greyhound service would just be one block from incarceration facilities to the north and south.
|
|
|
Post by jamesinclair on Feb 27, 2011 12:16:23 GMT -8
The current greyhound location is indeed strange.
|
|
|
Post by James Fujita on Feb 27, 2011 14:17:06 GMT -8
Perhaps we need a poll. Which of these sucks the least/ sucks the most: * Long Beach Transit Mall * 7th/ Metro * Norwalk * Atlantic, East Los Angeles * Sierra Madre Villa, Pasadena * Wilshire/ Western * North Hollywood * Redondo Beach/ Marine * Union Station If the question is worded "which sucks the least," Union Station should be left off the list, as it would overwhelm the others in its brilliance. Of course, there would be a certain amount of hometown/ home rail line boosterism, as I myself am rather fond of Long Beach's downtown, and the Transit Mall station lets out at Pine Avenue, just north of the convention center. Honestly, I don't understand the purpose of this poll. Which sucks the least? In terms of asthetics, LA Union Station is the # 1 station by and far. But, in terms of destinations, I would not put Union Station, 7th street, Wilshire/Western, LB Transit Mall, or North Hollywood in the same sentence/league with Atlantic, Sierra Madre, Norwalk or Redondo Beach. I think the point earlier was that we have some crappy terminal stations. Union Station, 7th street, Wilshire/Western, LB Transit Mall, or North Hollywood do not fit that consideration. Those are important stations with destinations. We've had polls to determine favorite stations, why not have a poll to determine your least favorite station? (Such a poll could have a useful function... at the very least, you're identifying those stations which need help.) I included all of the terminal stations just to be fair. I doubt that anybody would call Union Station a crappy station. Few would call 7th/ Metro or the Transit Mall crappy. I'm being slightly facetious here, but the whole discussion started because somebody said that the Expo Line will have a crappy terminal in November. Okay, that may be true. However, Los Angeles has plenty of crappy terminals. So we started listing crappy terminals. Then people started defending their hometown terminals. Fair enough. To settle the issue once and for all, I proposed a crappy terminal poll. Getting back to the issue at hand, I further propose that LaCienega would not be the worst terminal station in Los Angeles County. Get the Expo Line to LaCienega in November, please!
|
|
|
Post by erict on Feb 27, 2011 14:56:13 GMT -8
I vote for the blue line 103 st station as my least favorite rail station in the system. It is narrow and awful - barely fitting 4 people side by side. And it is a busy station. For now it seems to work - but only just barely. They can never fit a gate on this station without re-building it.
|
|
|
Post by LAofAnaheim on Feb 27, 2011 15:44:05 GMT -8
I vote for the blue line 103 st station as my least favorite rail station in the system. It is narrow and awful - barely fitting 4 people side by side. And it is a busy station. For now it seems to work - but only just barely. They can never fit a gate on this station without re-building it. I thought his poll was least favorite terminal station..... Okay, if we are doing this poll, at least put it in the right subject. It doesn't belong in "Metro Exposition Light Rail Transit Project" fodler in all due respect.
|
|
|
Post by James Fujita on Feb 27, 2011 16:07:36 GMT -8
Actually, I never specifically created a poll. There is an option somewhere on the message board for creating a poll, if I could only find it... I merely threw out the suggestion that we might need a poll ;D As of yet, I am not even certain if the poll should be limited to terminal stations. There are undoubtedly dozens of possible candidates, and perhaps there can be a nomination process. I do not intend to create an endless poll Certainly, if a poll is warranted, it ought to be put elsewhere. At the moment, I am a bit too busy/ tired to do so. Please, continue discussion of the Expo Line here.
|
|
|
Post by trackman on Feb 27, 2011 16:43:12 GMT -8
Actually, this pole might be best to postpone until the Expo line opens. Farmdale station is weird. Other Expo stations might be the same. They will have separate platforms based on direction, and, divided by a street.
My least favorite... Any of a number of stations along the Blue Line. Absolutely filthy outside the station. Washington and San Pedro top the list
|
|
|
Post by James Fujita on Feb 27, 2011 17:24:24 GMT -8
Poll's up. Please direct poll-related comments there. Thanks EDIT: That is, a poll to decide if there should be a poll.
|
|
|
Post by Gokhan on Feb 28, 2011 14:00:09 GMT -8
The La Cienega Station parking-structure floors have been coming up very fast after the difficult part of excavating and foundation work has been finished:
|
|
|
Post by theconstantg on Feb 28, 2011 14:26:31 GMT -8
We'll know soon enough, sure... But does anyone know how big the parking structure will be? Floors/spaces? Is there room for retail on the ground level?
|
|
|
Post by darrell on Feb 28, 2011 14:36:51 GMT -8
New photos from the weekend ... The Western station is looking nice against the camphor tree background, now with seating and trash cans. Trees are planted most of the way from Farmdale to Arlington. Views west (above) and east (below) from about Hayden in Culver City. A different view of the La Cienega parking structure.
|
|
|
Post by James Fujita on Feb 28, 2011 14:43:12 GMT -8
Nice photos!
I'm not a huge fan of parking structures, but I am realistic enough to recognize their continuing importance in the city of Los Angeles. People are going to be driving in from the neighborhoods off Fairfax and LaCienega to this station.
|
|
|
Post by LAofAnaheim on Feb 28, 2011 15:00:32 GMT -8
Will there be any ground floor retail for the parking structure? A coffee shop would be awesome...
|
|
K 22
Full Member
Posts: 117
|
Post by K 22 on Feb 28, 2011 15:08:31 GMT -8
A different view of the La Cienega parking structure. I like this one if only for the somewhat symbolic "Your Future Has Been Adjusted" billboard.
|
|
|
Post by mattapoisett on Feb 28, 2011 15:16:46 GMT -8
Will there be any ground floor retail for the parking structure? A coffee shop would be awesome... Do you think the Starbucks on the other side of the Jefferson/La Cienega is not close enough?
|
|
|
Post by LAofAnaheim on Feb 28, 2011 15:19:35 GMT -8
Do you think the Starbucks on the other side of the Jefferson/La Cienega is not close enough? True dat. Totally forgot. Still nice to see structures that include some sort of pedestrian activity on the ground floor. We need to move forward in LA of activitating our ground floor uses instead of giving 100% dedication to the personal automobile. I guess $4 gas isn't doing much....
|
|
|
Post by James Fujita on Feb 28, 2011 15:23:46 GMT -8
If I had to venture a guess, I'd say it's not looking very promising for permanent retail at the parking structure.
A shame, because certainly it is possible to build retail and parking together.
However, that structure doesn't look like it could accommodate retail larger than a cart. Or a vending machine.
Think of all of the hook ups that a retail operation would need (electrical, cable, water, phone, sewer) and little things like walls which would ideally go up at the same time as the "typical parking structure pillars".
|
|
|
Post by carter on Feb 28, 2011 16:41:13 GMT -8
If I had to venture a guess, I'd say it's not looking very promising for permanent retail at the parking structure. A shame, because certainly it is possible to build retail and parking together. However, that structure doesn't look like it could accommodate retail larger than a cart. Or a vending machine. Think of all of the hook ups that a retail operation would need (electrical, cable, water, phone, sewer) and little things like walls which would ideally go up at the same time as the "typical parking structure pillars". Depending on what kind of street space is available, this could be a good niche for food trucks and street vendors. UCLA does a really good job of allowing food trucks into the heart of campus, and regulating which ones get access on which days. Metro/City of L.A. could do great things by supporting this kind of arrangement with street level tables, chairs, shade structures etc. You could even charge small fees to vendors to cover some of the cost of maintenance.
|
|
bobj
New Member
Posts: 1
|
Post by bobj on Feb 28, 2011 16:58:40 GMT -8
Why a poll for the "worst" station--it's a real negative? A poll for the "best" designed, most functional station offers more--something to shoot at, a set of descriptors and design objectives.
|
|