Los Nietos Line: Downtown L.A. to Santa Fe Springs

[gatewaygent]

Why not? The ROW is still there...OK maybe just 50% of it except in the cities of Commerce/Bell Gardens where there are still two tracks remaining. My understanding is that the old Pacific Electric Whittier Line and Fullerton/La Habra/Yorba Linda Line weren't successful not simply because the trestles over the L.A. River, Rio Hondo Wash, and San Gabriel River were periodically washed out, but because in order to get to Whittier, you had to travel south to Slauson Junction and then head east along the Whittier ROW to Whittier/Fullerton/La Habra/Yorba Linda versus taking a more direct route such as down Whittier Boulevard. A LRT line that stops at Norwalk Boulevard in the Los Nietos portion of Santa Fe Springs along the old Whittier ROW would serve Huntington Park, Vernon, Bell, Maywood, Commerce, Bell Gardens, Pico Rivera, Santa Fe Spring as well as the fringes of northern Downey and southern Montebello. It's a natural and I'm surprised no one has proposed it. Part or all of the route could run on pre-existing Blue Line tracks (or on Gold Line tracks to a ROW in the median of Alameda Street then southwest under I-10 overpass to Long Beach Boulevard north, and then onto the Blue Line tracks). Stations along the route east of Slauson Station could be Pacific Bl. Station, Atlantic Av. Station, Eastern Av. Station, Gage Av./Telegraph Rd. Station, Rosemead Bl. Station, Pioneer Bl. Station, Norwalk Bl. Station, and infill stations to be determined at a later time. I think I'm going to write the city mayors/councils of those cities and see if they can convince Gloria Molina that it's a worthwhile venture. The BRU keeps insisting that rail projects only serve better to do communities--let's test the theory and see where it goes. Any further suggestions/guidance before I start writing? I still have hopes that the Purple Line subway will one day serve a different part of East L.A., Montebello, Pico Rivera, and Whittier (perhaps even La Habra and Fullerton if Orange County is so inclined.)

[Tony Fernandez]

That is a very long/wide ROW. It looks interesting, but I'm assuming that Metro doesn't own it if there are no proposals for it.

[kenalpern]

The Gateway Cities Council of Governments is mostly focused on expanding/widening the 710 and 5 freeways, and the rail project that it's been most focused on has been on a MagLev project using the P.E. ROW between Union Station and Orange County.

[gatewaygent]

No, Metro doesn't own the ROW. It belongs to Union Pacific if I'm not mistaken. Anyways, I'm disappointed. I thought the 710 & 5 frwys expansion/widening projects were already funded and so attention could be turned to serving the transit needs of the Gateway Cities themselves. And MagLeg from OC to Downtown L.A. you say? I don't understand how that benefits the Gateway Cities at all. Maybe I should start by writing to the Gateway Cities Council of Governments first; I suddenly have a lot of question I need answered because something is not kosher!

[roadtrainer]

And Mag-Leg from OC to Downtown L.A. you say? I don't understand how that benefits the Gateway Cities at all.

::)this is a picture of the Mag-leg people of Bellflower and Cerritos, these are the Geniuses who thought of a mag-leg train of speeds of 200 miles per hour and only want it elevated! And if I am not mistaken the route they want is less that 5 square miles! These ::)people who don't want light rail are like a Ostrage their heads are in the ground when it comes to reasonable transit, a light rail train to Lakewood blvd Green line station or even a "east-side Orange-line" makes more sense that a 200MPH mag-lag!!
Don't blame the Gateway council for this nonsense, Bellflower ::)and Cerritos decided it themselves......The Roadtrainer

[kenalpern]

The two of you may have some insights that I don't have...but I recommend you weigh in and let them know that they're not thinking right for a high-speed rail technology to be on a local commuter service that is best utilizing LRT.

The first thing I'd like to see would be a joint effort of L.A., Orange and Riverside County transit working together to create the eastern Green Line connection to the Norwalk Metrolink Transportation Center...but to do that we need to have the LAX Connection that would most likely galvanize that region into action.

As I see it, the Green Line to LAX would lead to a much greater push for previously explored (and even approved!) extensions to the Westside, South Bay and Gateway Cities. Until that happens, even that wise idea is dead in the water.

[gatewaygent]

Roadtrainer, where did you get all that info? I can't believe it's two (2) cities that are deciding the rail transit needs for the entire Gateway Cities region. When did that happen and why? Regardless, it gives me hope that if I write to and can succeed in persuading the cities along the old Whittier ROW that the Los Nietos Line is worthwhile, they can outnumber and outmaneuver Cerritos and Bellflower. MagLev my @$$! Plus I can't fathom how the MagLev Line would be easier to sell than the Los Nietos Line especially when most of it would run at grade on pre-existing ROW versus the MagLev Line which, as stated, would be grade separated.

Ken, I'd also like to see the eastern and LAX extensions of the Green Line come to fruition. As it stands it's the equivalent of driving a car without a windshield. Of course you can use it as is, but sooner, not later, is when you'll need that windshield. On another note, I myself am also partial to a north-south running "Atlantic Avenue Line" and a "Rosemead Bl./Lakewood Bl. Line" that would interconnect the Gateway Cities to the SGV. But those would be better described as their own topics I think.

[roadtrainer]

Gatewaygent:
My sources for the mag-leg train was Mr. Dana Gabbard of SO.CA.TA. He told me of corridor meetings that invited citizens of Bellflower and Cerritos only to this meeting and non-citizens were allowed to attend.

It was there that they took their vote for mag-leg trains only. Also if you look at the Long range Metro plan for transportation you will see that the Mag-leg is planned for about 30 years from now. Note it is the last thing on the list for any rail projects. (perhaps they should call it the Super-Duper Long Range Transportation Plan) One who think that communities that the Pacific Electric built would be excited about the rail coming back to their towns? Sincerely the Roadtrainer

[bobdavis]

The remaining section of the ex-PE Whittier Line serves mostly industrial areas (that's why the railway has survived) that do not offer prospects of the passenger volume needed to support light rail operations. As far as MagLev is concerned, even the Chinese are having second thoughts, and the Shanghai Airport line may be the only MagLev service in the world for quite a while. One wonders what kind of spare parts and tech support it will have in 10 or 15 years. The thing to remember is: No matter what the top speed is, train speed has to be Zero at the stations. BART trains can do 75 or 80 on the long stretches, but no where near those speeds under downtown SF.

[kenalpern]

The Gateway Cities need to do some serious soul-searching as to which project they want first with respect to rail, because right now they're en route to getting nothing for the indefinite future.

One of the big reasons I am pushing for a Green Line extension to LAX is because it might very much change the dynamic in the Gateway Cities in order to enhance local sentiment towards inclusion in a Green Line that suddenly goes somewhere...and which might also provide an alternative to the 91 and 105 freeways for commuters.

[gatewaygent]

It really is a shame that the Green Line currently goes from nowhere to nowhere. Once it goes to LAX and then perhaps to Venice Beach and Santa Monica, it would become a major route--it would go from nowhere to a major somewhere. Yet as much as I can appreciate extending the Green Line, it still does nothing for the people along the route of Los Nietos Line. If only several billion dollars were lying around...I would turn Los Nietos Line into Metrolink Service and take it to as far as Corona. Then I would develope Florence Avenue from Lakewood Avenue in Downey to LAX as HRT, cavernous stations and all. Heck, I'd even extend the Red Line from Vermont/Wilshire to Vermont/Florence just to make it interesting. But anyway, one dream at a time. I've started my letter writing. When I'm done and I've sent it out, I'll post it; and in the unlikely event I'm dignified with a response, I may post that too. Wish me luck.

[roadtrainer]

GatewayGent:

Focus on purpose! ;D

If you want to be an Napoleon, always think of the mission first! Forget about Army Regulations. Army Regulations are written by those who have never been in battle. They write about what they have told by others. General George S. Patton

I encourage you to write those letters and keep them going, Don't ever give up!! Remember the fight of the Friends of the Expo-Line. They prevailed!!
Sincerely, The Roadtrainer.