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Post by LAofAnaheim on Jun 21, 2011 10:33:12 GMT -8
Did the issue of Sepulveda grade separation and station location get settled? Yes, the board approved this in March www.buildexpo.org/pdf_uploads/boar_r7n9a740d.pdfThe Expo Line will be grade separated at Sepulveda and there is no commuter parking at Westwood station.
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Post by bobdavis on Jun 21, 2011 18:06:05 GMT -8
The comment about storage facilities is correct--they certainly don't add appeal to an area. That's why most of them are in industrial areas. They always make me think of George Carlin's "A Place for My Stuff" monologue. Here in Southern California, where basements are scarce and attics (if any) are cramped, these facilities find a ready market, but they can also prompt "treasure triage"--often inspired by a spouse's question: "You're spending HOW MUCH a month to stash that junk you couldn't fit into the garage?"
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Post by rajacobs on Jun 22, 2011 1:45:43 GMT -8
Walking past the future National/Palms station this evening, the implications of a center platform struck me: [/i] be from National, just before the current rail bridge. [/ul]Is there an to intention extend the new eastbound rail bridge into the existing earthen grade to allow a walkway from Exposition/National, or will the grade become MSE, requiring riders to walk around, to a point on National, north of the new rail bridge, but south of the existing bridge? From the west, just having to walk around the corner to an entrance on National/Palms makes the station seem (to me) cut off from part of the neighborhood.
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Post by Gokhan on Jun 22, 2011 11:48:40 GMT -8
Walking past the future National/Palms station this evening, the implications of a center platform struck me: [/i] be from National, just before the current rail bridge. [/ul]Is there an to intention extend the new eastbound rail bridge into the existing earthen grade to allow a walkway from Exposition/National, or will the grade become MSE, requiring riders to walk around, to a point on National, north of the new rail bridge, but south of the existing bridge? From the west, just having to walk around the corner to an entrance on National/Palms makes the station seem (to me) cut off from part of the neighborhood.[/quote] The station entrance will be from the east end of the center platform from under between the two bridges, in the northwest corner of National/Palms/Exposition. Unfortunately there can't be a west-end entrance to the center platform because it would create a pedestrian at-grade crossing across the southern track. A grade-separated pedestrian crossing would increase the cost.
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Post by darrell on Jun 22, 2011 14:14:40 GMT -8
Here's the sketch again of the Palms station: Note that this is two drawings of the two levels of the station. The west abutment of the new south bridge span is set back from National Blvd., so the stairs don't go all the way to the existing sidewalk. Yes, there is a big retaining wall.
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Post by jeisenbe on Jun 22, 2011 17:35:32 GMT -8
I wish they could put in a pedestrian crossing on the north-west side. If there is an emergency exit, why not spend a little more to put in a pedestrian walkway? The tracks are still elevated quite a bit at that point; you could get 8 feet of clearance underneath for a pedestrian underpass, which would only need to be 8 feet wide. How much would that cost?
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Post by rajacobs on Jun 22, 2011 19:03:48 GMT -8
On the National/Palms station-- ...you could get 8 feet of clearance underneath for a pedestrian underpass, which would only need to be 8 feet wide. How much would that cost? I was imagining 3 access points: to the east, next to the National bridge, to the SW, as you describe, under the tracks to Exposition towards the Price Warehouse, and then to the NW--stairs that go over the freeway adjacent to the eastbound I-10 on-ramp, terminating on Manning.
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Post by Alexis Kasperavičius on Jun 23, 2011 6:40:12 GMT -8
I wish they could put in a pedestrian crossing on the north-west side. If there is an emergency exit, why not spend a little more to put in a pedestrian walkway? The tracks are still elevated quite a bit at that point; you could get 8 feet of clearance underneath for a pedestrian underpass, which would only need to be 8 feet wide. How much would that cost? Contact them! Evangelize this thing and watch it happen. Don't forget that these engineers are working on the whole line and don't have the breadth of a local living next to a stop. They can rely on studies and best guesses, but a reasoned request from someone who speaks their language (i.e. "you") would be greatly welcomed by the team, I'm sure.
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Post by jeisenbe on Jun 23, 2011 11:31:22 GMT -8
I don't live anywhere near Palms, but it still seems like a good idea to me. Can the Transit Coalition suggest it as an organization? It seems like our collective voice would hold more weight. But I know the project is already expensive.
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Post by rajacobs on Jun 23, 2011 12:32:53 GMT -8
Is there any sort of a Palms Residents Association? Such a modification would specifically benefit the Palms community.
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dane
Junior Member
Posts: 59
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Post by dane on Jun 23, 2011 12:46:05 GMT -8
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Post by Alexis Kasperavičius on Jun 23, 2011 12:58:58 GMT -8
Yes, they're already aware of the line and in fact have petitioned Expo to change the name of the station to "Palms." Check out the link and I bet if you call the guy who wrote it (below), he could help. RE: Palms Station on the Expo Line (pdf)Contact Info: Charles Miller Overland Residential Representative Chair, Transportation & Road Works Committee Palms Neighborhood Council 310 204 4940 CharlesMiller@PalmsLA.org
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Post by Gokhan on Jun 23, 2011 17:03:31 GMT -8
Yes, they're already aware of the line and in fact have petitioned Expo to change the name of the station to "Palms." Check out the link and I bet if you call the guy who wrote it (below), he could help. RE: Palms Station on the Expo Line (pdf)Contact Info: Charles Miller Overland Residential Representative Chair, Transportation & Road Works Committee Palms Neighborhood Council 310 204 4940 CharlesMiller@PalmsLA.org Palms NC won't help. They aren't too involved with the project. Charles Miller is the person who pushed for station parking along Exposition Blvd around Bagley Ave. The problem is that the design has already progressed a lot and it would be hard to change things at this point. It would be nice to have the new bridge extended a little further west (without the MSE fill) so that there would be a second grade-separated, western entrance (from below) to the station as well. But it would cost money. On the bright side, I estimate the extra walking time to be only 1 - 2 minutes without a western entrance. So, it's not a huge biggie.
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Post by rajacobs on Jun 24, 2011 0:44:26 GMT -8
Progress on the Venice-Robertson bridge,
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Post by Gokhan on Jun 25, 2011 11:54:44 GMT -8
Oil-pipeline removal seems to be nearing completion in the Palms - Cheviot Hills area: Future Palms Station location: Just east of the National Blvd bridge: Dirt piles and fences are being removed near Bagley Ave. This is west of Bagley: After oil-pipeline removal southeast of Palms Park pedestrian bridge: Northwest of the Palms Park pedestrian bridge: Expo Line kitties near Palms Park: Expo Line kitty southeast of Palms Park:
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Post by rajacobs on Jun 27, 2011 10:24:46 GMT -8
Yesterday, three of us started at Overland and walked the ROW, through the tunnel, to Motor. As we started, we noted how close Overland Elementary School had placed their parking lot next to the ROW and wondered if it would be removed. The path grew silent, no people and even no cats, just a strong smell of creosote from the railroad ties, even after all the years. As has been noted, the ROW is a combination of cuts and fills that level the railbed very nicely. As you approach the tunnel from the west, a neatly cut hole appears in the chain link on the left of the tunnel entrance. We peered inside, warily, saw there was no on inside. But before we climbed inside we noted a stub of the oil pipeline emerging from the concrete. It had been closed off and sealed with a valve. Apparently when the freeway was built, the pipeline was encased in the tunnel wall and it's not going to be removed. Inside the tunnel, cans of spray paint littered the interior, their contents belched onto the tunnel walls that function as two endless canvases. I know nothing about gang graffiti so I can't comment on the graffiti content. There were no signs of habitation inside, which is ironic because just a few hours later (9PM) at the NE corner of Manning and National, we spied a woman next to a parked car and the sidewalk. She was asleep with an arm curled around a wheel of her wheelchair. ...Apparently some of the homeless have nowhere safe even to crash for the night. ...But back to the tunnel. At the west end of the tunnel, another neatly cut hole in the chain link appeared on the right side. We crawled out of the tunnel. A notation on the concrete read: "Spraypaint, if you need it" with an arrow pointing downward to a spraycan sitting on the ground. We continued along the ROW, climbed some bars with parts conveniently broken off to allow passage into a parking lot and proceeded out the gate at the corner of Irene and Motor. We wondered why apparently there has been no policing of the tunnel and imagined that the tunnel is probably a low priority since it's not yet an active construction site. As we walked toward National/Palms/Exposition we passed between Barbri (3280 Motor) and the U-Haul Neighborhood Dealer (10321 National) to get back on the ROW / Barbri parking lot (headed east). A homeless person lying on the concrete at the back of the Barbri facility, off the walk up to the ROW, eyed us as we passed. Just before the National/Palms bridge, we left the ROW and went through the dirty and trash-strewn National Bl. freeway underpass--reminiscent of the tunnel(!)-- before encountering the homeless woman. We were left with impressions of neglect: the tunnel, the homeless, the underpass--but also impressions of possibility and change.
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Post by Gokhan on Jun 27, 2011 10:46:20 GMT -8
This is my immediate neighborhood and I'm well familiar with what you described, including the inside of the tunnel.
There was little reason to police the tunnel after the freight service was discontinued, especially given that there is little to no crime and are no gangs at all in this neighborhood.
The steel meshes serving as gates to the tunnel was either cut by the graffiti artists or to let the cats in an out. On the northwest side there was a gate that used to be always open and on the southeast side there is the steel mesh -- which originally only had a cat hole in the bottom and now there is a huge hole.
Interesting that you saw an oil pipe sticking out. The tunnel is a concrete box structure backfilled with earth and the pipe wouldn't be inside the concrete but inside the backfill. Chances are that it probably cuts through the concrete only through the windwall, not through the main structure. I wish you had a picture.
It will be a challenge to fit two tracks in this tunnel, which is only 25-ft-wide. I heard some rumors, which are probably false, that the 29.9-ft-wide USC tunnel is unable to accommodate two trains at the same time due to clearance issues. If that were true, it would be awful for the opening of Phase 1, as they would have to do major modifications in the tunnel.
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Post by rajacobs on Jun 27, 2011 12:22:33 GMT -8
It will be a challenge to fit two tracks in this tunnel, which is only 25-ft-wide. I heard some rumors, which are probably false, that the 29.9-ft-wide USC tunnel is unable to accommodate two trains at the same time due to clearance issues. If that were true, it would be awful for the opening of Phase 1, as they would have to do major modifications in the tunnel. I had thoughts of homeless walking into the tunnel after service begins and trying to camp out sometime after the last train. but with no clearance in the tunnel, it would be attempted no more than once. Graffiti is another story. Perhaps the presence of trains will offer a challenge. If 29.9 ft proves to be an issue, the tunnel's 25 ft you might call a show-stopper that requires some greater bucks to fix.
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Post by Gokhan on Jun 27, 2011 13:41:50 GMT -8
It will be a challenge to fit two tracks in this tunnel, which is only 25-ft-wide. I heard some rumors, which are probably false, that the 29.9-ft-wide USC tunnel is unable to accommodate two trains at the same time due to clearance issues. If that were true, it would be awful for the opening of Phase 1, as they would have to do major modifications in the tunnel. I had thoughts of homeless walking into the tunnel after service begins and trying to camp out sometime after the last train. but with no clearance in the tunnel, it would be attempted no more than once. Graffiti is another story. Perhaps the presence of trains will offer a challenge. If 29.9 ft proves to be an issue, the tunnel's 25 ft you might call a show-stopper that requires some greater bucks to fix. Just like in the USC tunnel, there will have to be an intrusion-detection system for the CPUC approval of this grade-separated rail crossing. In the USC tunnel, there are two walkways on the sides. In this tunnel there will only be a center walkway. The trains are 11-ft-wide dynamically (at a curve); so, leaving half a foot of distance on each side would allow a 2-plus-ft-wide walkway in the middle -- a bare squeeze space when two trains are coming.
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Post by Gokhan on Jun 27, 2011 15:07:53 GMT -8
New agenda is posted. City of Santa Monica is getting what they want. Expo will now spend $360 thousand on new preliminary engineering for side platforms on 26th St and a second entrance to 17th St. Of course, there will be much more additional cost when they actually build these. Hopefully these won't delay the project too much. The question is that, given that Santa Monica has been asking for these all along, why are they being brought up so late? They will pay URS a whopping $35 million to manage Phase 2. Hopefully this extra spending will result in Phase 2 being done more smoothly than Phase 1. Groundbreaking is in July. We should learn the exact date at the meeting. I wonder what the location will be but I expect between Overland and Westwood.
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Post by Alexis Kasperavičius on Jun 27, 2011 16:54:27 GMT -8
Gökhan, I spoke with one of the field engineers during the first train testing and he explained that a temporary ventilation system in the USC tunnel was preventing one of the tracks from being used. Once the permanent ventilation system is installed, all will be well.
As a side note, he said that all of the stations are online - with telephones, signs - and video cameras - already operational in central command.
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Post by Gokhan on Jun 27, 2011 21:29:23 GMT -8
Gökhan, I spoke with one of the field engineers during the first train testing and he explained that a temporary ventilation system in the USC tunnel was preventing one of the tracks from being used. Once the permanent ventilation system is installed, all will be well. The issue would be at the bend, where the dynamic width of the trains increase to a maximum. It's impossible to verify whether there is a clearance issue without both trains running in the opposite direction at that point simultaneously. But I would doubt that the rumor has any foundation. I had been told that they would use 11 ft for the dynamic width, which they had said would be enough.
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Post by metrocenter on Jun 28, 2011 7:24:30 GMT -8
City of Santa Monica is getting what they want. Expo will now spend $360 thousand on new preliminary engineering for side platforms on 26th St and a second entrance to 17th St. Of course, there will be much more additional cost when they actually build these. To be clear, the changes/upgrades will be funded by the City of Santa Monica, not by Expo: SUMMARY ... The City has stated an interest in funding a Betterment to revise the 26th Street Station from a center platform to a side platform configuration and to add a second patron entrance at the 17th Street Station.
...
FINANCIAL IMPACT Funding for the proposed action would be provided by the City.
-- Agenda item 6e
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Post by Gokhan on Jun 28, 2011 9:29:44 GMT -8
To be clear, the changes/upgrades will be funded by the City of Santa Monica, not by Expo: Thanks for catching it and pointing it out. The 26th St and 17th St Station betterments are amounting to $10 - 13 million. It's an incredible amount of money for improving two at-grade stations. This is probably partly because they weren't included in the original bids, where there was competition.
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Post by rajacobs on Jun 28, 2011 10:30:50 GMT -8
Too bad the Palms Neighborhood Community & the Cheviot Hills Home Owners Assoc. couldn't get together and request (and fund) some alterations to the station at National/Palms/Exposition. I keep imagining a split platform that allows continued used of only the trestle and no additional bridge; the split platform would have access from underneath, also from the east, and also a pedestrian bridge across the freeway next to the Eastbound Santa Monica Freeway on-ramp that terminates at Manning. OK, I've said htat before... Ahhh, wishful thinking. Amazing what tens of millions of dollars could do.
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Post by Gokhan on Jun 30, 2011 11:03:34 GMT -8
Digging under Motor Avenue freeway bridge taking place right now. Likely Expo-related.
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Post by Gokhan on Jun 30, 2011 17:23:05 GMT -8
Phase 2 groundbreaking will take place on September 12, 2011 (yes, 2011! LOL), 9:30 am.
Heavy construction for Phase 2 will begin in about a couple of months with the Venice Boulevard LRT bridge. Either Balfour Beatty or Skanska/Rados will be selected to build it.
After lessons learned from Phase 1, overhead power line relocation will start soon.
There is a Santa Monica maintenance-facility design meeting tonight.
More info on the Phase 1 thread.
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Post by carter on Jun 30, 2011 22:25:28 GMT -8
Phase 2 groundbreaking will take place on September 12, 2011 (yes, 2011! LOL), in the morning. Heavy construction for Phase 2 will begin in about a couple of months with the Venice Boulevard LRT bridge. Either Balfour Beatty or Skanska/Rados will be selected to build it. After lessons learned from Phase 1, overhead power line relocation will start soon. There is a Santa Monica maintenance-facility design meeting tonight. More info on the Phase 1 thread. Why is 2011 a "lol?"
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Post by Gokhan on Jun 30, 2011 23:23:25 GMT -8
Phase 2 groundbreaking will take place on September 12, 2011 (yes, 2011! LOL), in the morning. Heavy construction for Phase 2 will begin in about a couple of months with the Venice Boulevard LRT bridge. Either Balfour Beatty or Skanska/Rados will be selected to build it. After lessons learned from Phase 1, overhead power line relocation will start soon. There is a Santa Monica maintenance-facility design meeting tonight. More info on the Phase 1 thread. Why is 2011 a "lol?" It's kind of an inside joke by the board members. Since they've all realized that this project is moving forward at a geological timescale, they will always ask to verify the year after a date is given. In fact not much construction is expected till late 2012; so, groundbreaking could well be in September 2012. See the end of Part 1 audio for the joke. (More of the board meeting is in Phase 1 thread.)
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Post by davebowman on Jul 7, 2011 9:38:15 GMT -8
Driving to work from Santa Monica to USC in the morning I've noticed that there is some sort of surface grading or construction work happening on the south side of Olympic between 26th St. and Cloverfield, adjacent to the self-storage facility. Does this have anything to do with Expo Phase 2, or is it a commercial project?
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