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Post by bluelineshawn on Oct 25, 2011 13:03:06 GMT -8
I thought I heard that expo was supposed to run at 12 minute rush hour headway's with 3 car sets for phase 1 since there are not enough rail cars for more frequent service and to keep frequencies even with the blue line which is supposed to be running at 6 minute headway's when expo opens. If that's the case this is a positive development even if its not pre-revenue service That is correct. Expo will initially only have 12-minute max headways so I think that could be the headway used for pre-revenue testing. Or maybe they have to test the max they could expect. Not sure how that works.
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Post by bluelineshawn on Oct 25, 2011 13:12:01 GMT -8
Do they ever test the maximum headways a line can support, like 90 seconds? Or does not get tested but simply implemented as needed? They tested the maximum anticipated headways on the blue line a few years ago. That was every 3 minutes or 20 trains per hour on the Washington to 7th/metro portion. What's interesting is that IIRC they said that it didn't go very smoothly. I think that they could turn the trains ok, but trains started bunching on Flower. That's why they're so worried about the combined Expo/Blue line service. If trains aren't perfectly synchronized (which is almost impossible for street running) things start to fall apart. My guess is that they will have to adjust the blue line trip time by a couple of minutes to account for the delays and have trains wait to synchronize. Still things will get screwed. No way around it with street running.
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Post by jamesinclair on Oct 25, 2011 14:06:19 GMT -8
Will 12 minute testing headways be running on Saturday during USC game time?
Or are they still putting carpet over the tracks?
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Post by rajacobs on Oct 25, 2011 14:57:03 GMT -8
Ever 12 minutes through the crowds would be a great test!
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Post by Gokhan on Oct 25, 2011 18:52:47 GMT -8
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Post by metrocenter on Oct 25, 2011 19:20:59 GMT -8
Maybe she just got tired of waiting for the Expo Line to open, and decided to inaugurate it herself!
Whatever the case, it's obviously Metro's fault. I mean, how can the public possibly be expected to tell the difference between a train trackway and a street? It's just so complicated, it hurts my head even thinking about it!
(As a side note, that "no left turn" sign looks like crap. Maybe people are using it for target practice.)
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Post by jamesinclair on Oct 25, 2011 23:12:22 GMT -8
Happens all the time in Boston, and those tracks have been there for like 100 years. There was an incident this past weekend too.
And it WILL be a problem in LA when it rains, because everything gets so damn shiny.
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Post by bluelineshawn on Oct 26, 2011 6:51:15 GMT -8
Perhaps they need more visible signs. You can drive on the tracks in some cities after all, although I've never thought that any portion of the Expo line looked confusing in that way. They made a bigger deal out of it than perhaps was necessary as it looks like the car could be easily backed out.
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Post by LAofAnaheim on Oct 26, 2011 9:19:40 GMT -8
Perhaps they need more visible signs. You can drive on the tracks in some cities after all, although I've never thought that any portion of the Expo line looked confusing in that way. They made a bigger deal out of it than perhaps was necessary as it looks like the car could be easily backed out. You can never prevent enough of these situations. Nothing can be fool-proof. There's already a ton of "No car" signs on the tracks at every at-grade intersection. How much more do we need? It takes common sense after a while. We can't anti-dumb everything in the world.
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Post by Gokhan on Oct 26, 2011 11:35:52 GMT -8
There is a minor design problem there. Initially this section was going to be ballasted, as there is no reason for embedded track, since it's not meant for emergency-vehicle access. But, then, as a compromise to USC, they specified embedded track to improve the aesthetics in the EIR, which is, of course, a subjective issue. If a vehicle accidentally enters the tracks westbound at Vermont, thinking that they are drivable, it will soon encounter the ballasted section starting just west of the Vermont Station. If they had made the section in front of USC on Exposition ballasted as originally planned, this wouldn't be an issue.
And, yes, there are "No vehicles on tracks" signs at these crossings.
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Post by Gokhan on Oct 26, 2011 11:44:50 GMT -8
Update on the Expo Line: Culver City Station work is progressing, and they are in the process of hooking up the TPSS at Washington and National, which is needed before the train tests can start there. Bike-path construction in Culver City is in progress with utility installation taking place. Not much work is taking place along the line any more, but sadly, there is still work to be done. They were doing something on the Vermont Station for example. It looks like there is still no train testing west of Western. Train testing is taking place east of Western. There was some repair work possibly taking place at Buckingham (west of Crenshaw), as there was an electrical contractor there. The permanent amber-alert displays along Exposition are now warning against test trains. Farmdale Station work seems to have stopped for now, with canopies in place. They still need to build the communication building there. Some motorcycle cop had been called to the La Cienega Station. Let's hope that one of our picture takers here didn't end up getting arrested trying to sneak up to the platform.
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Post by bobdavis on Oct 26, 2011 15:52:22 GMT -8
Regarding the "wanna be hi-railer": San Francisco Muni used to get automobiles in Twin Peaks Tunnel from time to time (a bit more difficult with the current high-platform configuration), and the Philadelphia streetcar subway gets an occasional automotive visitor. Chances of such occurences increase when out-of-towners, drunks, and (nowadays) texters are in the vicinity. Noting today's plethora of law-enforcement vehicles and personnel--must have been a slow day, it certainly seems to be overkill unless the driver had an outstanding felony warrant.
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Post by jamesinclair on Oct 26, 2011 17:16:16 GMT -8
Boston also gets the occasional car in the bus tunnels. The old one anyway (used to be trolley tunnels), the new bus tunnels has some fancy "anti-terrorism" thing set up where a non-MBTA vehicle gets stopped by quickly rising bollards.
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Post by darrell on Oct 27, 2011 10:49:12 GMT -8
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Post by Gokhan on Oct 27, 2011 10:53:08 GMT -8
Is that Nippon - Sharyo car coupled to Siemens cars? Is that a four-car train (not that it would be useful for actual operations)?
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Post by darrell on Oct 27, 2011 11:42:50 GMT -8
Is that Nippon - Sharyo car coupled to Siemens cars? Is that a four-car train (not that it would be useful for actual operations)? Unfortunately I didn't think to walk over and look last night, and I can't tell from the photo's angle.
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Post by simonla on Oct 27, 2011 17:05:08 GMT -8
Thank you expolinefan for the pics and updates!
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Post by Gokhan on Oct 27, 2011 21:15:01 GMT -8
All the Station Platforms have Orange Plastic Fencing Blocking Paths to All Platforms Perhaps it has to do with the motorcycle-cop incident I posted yesterday. Hopefully no vandalism happened at the La Cienega Station. They should have been fenced long time ago.
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Post by jamesinclair on Oct 28, 2011 0:19:07 GMT -8
So I guess no testing during the USC game? Lamesausages.
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Post by Gokhan on Oct 28, 2011 10:18:09 GMT -8
The system still seems down west of Western Avenue. The traffic lights at Buckingham Road are now not working and they are set at a flashing mode. They are working on the train-control circuits at various places (such as 7th Avenue) along the line.
I saw a three-car Siemens test train buzzing by at Normandie Avenue.
I think the earliest this line can open seems to be in February, unless they decide to open it to Western Avenue. It would be really smart for them to speed up the Culver City work so that they can open the entire line in February or March. By the way, the TPSS at Washington and National Boluevards seems to be almost ready and the train testing there probably can start soon.
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Post by Gokhan on Oct 28, 2011 14:34:28 GMT -8
Thursday Mornning I saw BBR and BBI Engineers Looking at All the Siginal Control Boxes One is to Wonder if thay are Check ing these Out Now and not the Phase-! Contractor BBR was the subcontractor who built them. FFP doesn't know how to build rail equipment -- they hire subcontractors.
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Post by roadtrainer on Oct 29, 2011 6:42:51 GMT -8
Somebody with some pull around here send a e-mail and tell Phase II contractors to buy and use the same software amd hardware that The major railroad use. Thier signals run come sun, rain, snow ar hail! Sincerely The Roadtrainer
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Post by Gokhan on Oct 31, 2011 9:12:20 GMT -8
This has never happened before. I wonder why:
NOVEMBER 3, 2011, BOARD MEETING IS CANCELED.
THE NEXT BOARD MEETING IS SCHEDULED ON DECEMBER 1, 2011, AT 2:30 PM.
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Post by metrocenter on Oct 31, 2011 12:01:41 GMT -8
I can't speak to meetings of the Expo Board, but the Metro Board cancels 1-2 meetings per year.
Having said that, this does seem very unusual given that the project is now in its most critical phase.
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Post by Gokhan on Oct 31, 2011 14:23:30 GMT -8
Having said that, this does seem very unusual given that the project is now in its most critical phase. It is indeed. Culver City Station may catch up with the rest of the line with regard to train testing if they can't repair the line in two weeks. So, at this point, it might be wise for them to speed up the Culver City part for an early-2012 opening of the entire line.
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Post by jdrcrasher on Oct 31, 2011 18:50:45 GMT -8
Wait, did I just see some construction people in some of the railcars? Do they get a free ride from work?
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Post by jamesinclair on Oct 31, 2011 19:01:37 GMT -8
In expolinefans first video above, the gates near the beginning are down for 1.5 minutes. Why is that necessary?
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Post by jamesinclair on Oct 31, 2011 19:16:23 GMT -8
Also, thoughts on the USC grade crossing for events at the Coliseum. First of all, Metro should have taken advantage of the problem this season. Run the test trains every 6 minutes with giant banners reading "Expo Line opening December 2011. Downtown for only $1.50!" It would be especially relevant because of $25 parking and the huge traffic hassle. As for the future, it's going to be a problem. It will always be a problem. Quite frankly, the underground section should have been extended one more block. You know the NIMBY complaints that rail = Berlin wall? Well, in this case...they're right. Theres literally a brick wall for half a mile separating USC from expo park. The station looks pretty good at night. But theres no denying that this is a wall killing pedestrian flow and any interaction between campus and the park. Putting it underground would have allowed for more natural crossings, ones that actually work with the park and USC plans. Underground would have meant a green median, as an extension of the park. It would have meant bike lanes and sidewalks that aren't insults to pedestrians. Instead, it's ugly, it breaks up the environment, and it will be a hassle. As for game days? I don't see how it will work. The intersection looks like this for well over an hour before the game, and another hour after. Look, there are many light rail lines that serve major event centers and stadiums. But I cant think of a single one that requires 70,000* people to walk over the tracks. (*90,000 stadium capacity - 20,000 arriving from south) Service will be slow on the expo line, and that will screw up the blue line. And as for the number one advantage, that people can ride expo to the game? The platforms are too damn narrow. And further, one of the best advantages of at grade rail was ruined when metro decided that stations need only a single entrance/exit point. That makes sense with underground stations, where its expensive. But at grade? Seriously? And leaving the game will be just as bad. Thousands of people trying to wait for a train, while thousands more walk over the track? Would be faster to walk to staples center (and the $5 parking downtown) Metro got to save a couple of bucks now, and in return gets 100 years of bad design and poor performance. I dont think it was worth it.
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Post by jamesinclair on Oct 31, 2011 19:17:13 GMT -8
In expolinefans first video above, the gates near the beginning are down for 1.5 minutes. Why is that necessary? Well from the time they approach the Station and the Train sits at the Station and till it clears the crossing it is 90 seconds in each direction Why dont the gates wait until the train is ready to move to go down? Was it really so hard to design a gate where it can be activated by the driver?
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Post by jamesinclair on Oct 31, 2011 19:36:58 GMT -8
Why dont the gates wait until the train is ready to move to go down? Was it really so hard to design a gate where it can be activated by the driver? this Design was Orderd by the California Public Utilities Commission (CPUC) I dont understand the point. What additional safety does it provide? Actually, makes things more dangerous. People sit at gate that has been lowered for 45+ seconds and nothing happens. next time, theyre going to try to beat the gate, or take gates less seriously because they assume all gates are "broken" in that they dont reflect real world conditions. Think of it like pedestrian crossing signals that say "dont cross" long before the perpendicular traffic gets green. People jaywalk because they "know" they have another 30 seconds. Is this the case only at Farmdale?
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